Why are you not vegan....

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edGfaCTor said:
Responding to the post by Johno please?.

"Not one single person has posted any articles or studies that you're average western diet or carnivore diet is healthier than a plant based one, unlike the oxford study and academy of nutrition and dietetics ones that I provided."

"But il say it again because people like you are still not getting it, veganism isnt even about nutrition, its about not wanting to pay for animals to be abused and killed for food, clothing or sport."

"Well done, youve posted pictures of people who are not taking in enough calories xD "veganism debunked"!!!111"

"I don't know why you're so concerned with supplements, millions of people take them, multivitamins or protein powders, you almost certainly supplement B12, you just don't know it."

"The vegan agenda is we don't want to harm animals. But because there's literally is no argument to counter that it always gets deflected to diet and nutrition. Your convinced eating the 'carnivore diet' has somehow cured you of something, despite you even saying yourself, eating a plant based diet could have had the same results. But hey maybe it has, still doesn't mean the "carnivore diet" is healthy."



I am not going to quote all of your post which is really a bunch of rubbish.

First quote here is the answer no one has posted any studies because no diet has any valid ones and your study you mention again useless.

Second quote Veganism is an ideology correct it has nothing to do with human health but the whole protecting animals from abuse/killer arguments doesn't work now people will ask why it's simple a vegan being alive is causing harm to animals the only way to help them is for you to die.

Now I know people will say this is extreme but it's not how can you live the vegan way without insects or animals you can't take a look at how food is produced and this is when you look into other areas not nutrition.

Third quote this straight away shows you know 0 on the subject of nutrition using calories as an argument maybe you should learn what a "calorie" is before putting out a claim like this.

Fourth quote If you are eating a correct diet why would you need to supplement? If millions of people drink own urine it's fine as well is it? this argument makes 0 sense and people take all these because they have been tricked to do so.

Fifth quote answered already and already countered it another one you are incorrect on.

I would like to point out I do have a qualification in nutrition and it is meaningless also I have family members who run a farm.

Closing point the pictures you posted are useless for a start the first one is the person known as Vegan Gains (Richard Burgess) who you can be looked up easily and see he has health issues plus is taking juice.

That same guy has claimed to know science like yourself yet can't even understand basics also people who are trained in the field have called him out many times the same with all you vegans yet you run away.
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I bet you drive a pickup truck (no offence Rroff)
 
edGfaCTor said:
Veganism is an ideology correct it has nothing to do with human health but the whole protecting animals from abuse/killer arguments doesn't work now people will ask why it's simple a vegan being alive is causing harm to animals the only way to help them is for you to die.

Now I know people will say this is extreme but it's not how can you live the vegan way without insects or animals you can't take a look at how food is produced and this is when you look into other areas not nutrition.
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I am not going to quote all of your post which is really a bunch of rubbish. But wow at you.
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Efour said:
Oat milk is pretty good tbh I'll drink it like a normal glass of milk. Pretty good texture and consistency.

I had pea protein milk, mmmm that was different.

I won't buy it unless it's on offer though.
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I would try oat milk purely because I do have a minor concern about hormones from regular milk. Will see if we can get it here.
 
Freefaller said:
I made the painful journey of giving up dairy but I'm definitely healthier for it (blood and gut flora tests confirm - I'm a fitness fanatic so do regular blood tests and studied a lot about nutrition) and oat milk is amazing, soya is not. I miss cheese a lot. And I do still have fresh butter from the local farm from time to to time, and whilst I don't go out of my way to tell people I avoid dairy I make choices at restaurants based on my dietary needs.

I.e. I won't tell friends or family not to cook with butter or cheese, but avoid it if I can.
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How are you healthier?

Which blood tests?

Regular blood test for which reasons and which tests?

How is oat milk amazing?

If you are having butter why not cheese?

It is your choice to avoid dairy.

Dairy issues tend to be more related to pasteurization when the same people switch to raw product they no longer tend to have the problem unless they do have a real intolerance or other gut issues which have nothing to do with dairy once that is corrected they are fine with it.
 
Berry Merjinik said:
What if they had the name of the animal on the body part you were buying?
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What, like Daisy or Curly?

Yeah, I don't think that would stop me eating their sirloin steak or bacon, even if I knew them before.

I used to volunteer on a farm back when I was a young teenager. There was one cow which always came up to us, was extremely friendly (even when just spreading straw) and oddly (for a cow) even enjoyed us riding on its back like a horse the couple of times we did (cruel as that was in hindsight), yet we knew it would end up as steak and a roast. Back then, as a 12 or 13 year old we'd have preferred if it hadn't been killed (being as immature as we were it wasn't far off being a pet), but it was better eating it as part of a Sunday roast.

Maybe primarily city folk will never understand that, but that's the way it is and has been for millennia. The alternative is cattle, sheep, chickens, goats and so on going extinct, as if nobody is farming them then nobody is protecting them from foxes, dogs and diseases such as TB.

Now while I don't agree with certain halal practices, I'm pretty sure a shot to the head is better than letting them roam free only to be chased until exhaustion and an agonisingly long and painful death by a dog or fox.
 
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edGfaCTor said:
How are you healthier?

Which blood tests?

Regular blood test for which reasons and which tests?

How is oat milk amazing?

If you are having butter why not cheese?

It is your choice to avoid dairy.

Dairy issues tend to be more related to pasteurization when the same people switch to raw product they no longer tend to have the problem unless they do have a real intolerance or other gut issues which have nothing to do with dairy once that is corrected they are fine with it.
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Yes it's my choice to avoid dairy. Plenty of evidence to support that it's not ideal for health. At the same time it's not awful either. That said raw milk is ideal but it's the processing of the milk that ***** it up really. I'm a bit of a nutrition bore ask any of the gym rats over the last 20 years! :D

I do regular blood tests for my own interests and personal health. NHS don't offer it. Covers full lipid profile, hormones, haemoglobin etc... I also have done 3 gut flora analysis since stopping dairy and there's been a reduction in inflammatory response, albeit really minor and not bad for my health. Other than cheese I don't miss drinking gallons of milk (typical gym rat thing, whey protein and dairy!).

Oat milk is amazing as in it's a great alternative to dairy and not soya which is full of phytoestrogens and not all that nice either.

I agree with you with regards to raw milk - I live in the countryside and can get it here. However, I find it easier to avoid dairy now. I have butter very rarely but as I said I still enjoy it. Neither do I make a fuss about dairy at friend's house or whatever, but tend to avoid it in restaurant and when shopping in general.

Not sure what the point of your reply to me was. I'm not vegan, I have reduced my meat intake however, and we are fastidious when it comes to buying meat and animal produce. I.e. fresh eggs from the next door neighbour, meat from the local farms. Not sure what I said that was controversial to you but hopefully you can rest easy now.

I guess from a philosophical angle one could explore whether thanks to animal husbandry we are the only mammals or animal to drink another animal's milk or whether other animals should drink other animal's milk which ultimately is a little perverse... Personally doesn't bother me, though again it goes back to animal welfare etc.... It's quite staggering the scale at which meat and milk is produced. Hence why we make the effort to source things locally, albeit it's a bit more money but I think worth it.
 
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Tony Edwards said:
How many Japanese are vegetarian also? For 1200 years they were strict vegetarians due to buddhism and Im going to guess there are a fair few that are still vegetarians.

Oh I see its about Buddhists not being vegan which is true to an extent but they shouldnt be eating meat. Its one of their main principles of the universe.
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Actually if you had googled that you will find that Japanese eat meat at 91% of the population. If you had been there, you would find that it’s quite difficult to find life a vegan diet. Dashi, a broth base that is use in a lot of cooking, is made of fish and kombu. The foundation of a lot of their cooking has dashi.

A lot of people in Japan would say they are Buddhist but they are not living like monks. There is a difference, it’s like I know plenty of catholics who has sex before marriage.

The only statistic that matters is the Japanese lives the longest are the vast majority of them are not vegan. That fact is NOT disputed.

You can pick a person or a group who eat meats that died in their 60’s but no studies has a group of 100million sample size.

So any statistical heath benefits of a vegan diet do not have the same weight as the meat eating Japanese population. Not the number and not the duration over the years.

What we know is that eating McDonald’s and processed meat is just not good for you. Just stop eating that rubbish if you want to be healthy, you can be healthy and continue to eat meat if you want, just make it balance with lots of fruit and veg. It’s pretty simple?
 
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Every now and then, I have tried various different non dairy milks. Most of the time is when the fresh stuff is reduced to 10-20p at work. I thought I would like hazelnut milk has like Nutella and chocolate with hazelnuts in them. It was blooming awful.

My favourite is oat followed by almond. Though yet to find a non dairy milk which doesn't cloy my coffee. I am not in the frothing mood either
 
edGfaCTor said:
How are you healthier?

Which blood tests?

Regular blood test for which reasons and which tests?

How is oat milk amazing?

If you are having butter why not cheese?

It is your choice to avoid dairy.

Dairy issues tend to be more related to pasteurization when the same people switch to raw product they no longer tend to have the problem unless they do have a real intolerance or other gut issues which have nothing to do with dairy once that is corrected they are fine with it.
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As a carnivore I limit dairy aswell due to poor quality and high sugar content of pasteurised milk etc. Raw, when I can get it is the way forward. So much tastier and better for you.
Berry Merjinik said:
What if they had the name of the animal on the body part you were buying?
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While not directed at me, honestly this doesn't bother me in the slightest. Why should it? Again do I think animal welfare and slaughtering could be better, yes of course I do. But would it having a name or Facebook account stop me from pulling the trigger on the bolt gun myself? No because it's nature and some animals are there to feed others.
 
Berry Merjinik said:
I've got 800g of diced beef in the fridge for tomorrow, hmm a plain casserole or make a pie with it?
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A pie all day long. Or a stroganoff if you've got some mushrooms handy, as controversial as some may take it at the moment. I'll never understand why they've fallen out of fashion as they're blooming tasty.
 
be happy with your life choices but don't be judgemental to people who don't think the same huh?
If I had to kill my own meat i wouldn't tbh, I been brought up only know my granny saying i'm a good bone picker lol....less food as we were poor so every gram counted.
How is being brought up poor going today? Is it easy to bring children up on a single parent minimum or just above minimum wage income?
 
I was raised a meat / dairy / sugar eater and could never stop when an adult.

Some things are just very hard to give up, that is the truth of it.
 
Had some lovely Italian meatballs tonight. Biguns. Visiting Mother went shopping at the local farmers market and they had some samples..tasted so good she bought a bunch on the spot. Meal tonight was wonderful.
 
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