Caporegime
Why are you not vegan....
- Thread starter Johno please?
- Start date
- Status
Don
Guys, some of you are sailing quite close to the wind. Please stop with the veiled insults. If you can't discuss in good-faith without digging at people then please don't post.
Anti-meat people are vegan. Anti-palm oil people are...?
There is no better alternative that yields so much oil with so little harmful pesticide. So it is fun to be anti-palm oil but we need a slightly more informed response. If we didn't have palm oil as a crop we'd have to clear even more land.
i wish those who are claiming vegan diet isn’t healthy and expensive would post their meal plans and shopping list so we can see what they eat.
In the house, I eat pretty much 100% vegan and it’s healthy, nutritious and relatively inexpensive. I bet it’s more balanced, more vegetables and more pulses than the meat eaters and probably cheaper though I caveat the final part as weirldy, bad, processed vegan food is expensive. Bad, processed meat food is cheap.
I’m doing the shopping tonight for the next 8 dinners so I’ll post the plan once I’ve finished it.
In the house, I eat pretty much 100% vegan and it’s healthy, nutritious and relatively inexpensive. I bet it’s more balanced, more vegetables and more pulses than the meat eaters and probably cheaper though I caveat the final part as weirldy, bad, processed vegan food is expensive. Bad, processed meat food is cheap.
I’m doing the shopping tonight for the next 8 dinners so I’ll post the plan once I’ve finished it.
Soldato
I did a big BBQ yesterday...1/4s, hot dogs, ribs etc. Was very good. At no point will I claim this is healthy lol. It was very enjoyable though.
Tonight I will likely do Lemon garlic pork, potatoes and a side.
Note: most supermarket meat is trash. Proper butcher prepared is so much better.
Tonight I will likely do Lemon garlic pork, potatoes and a side.
Note: most supermarket meat is trash. Proper butcher prepared is so much better.
When buying whole foods , meat will always be more expensive than veggies. My meat is bought online from a reputable farm as I prefer to buy grass reared Beef / organic chicken and it's really not cheap.
Price I'm willing to pay for better quality meat that comes from cows that are grown for much longer and fed nothing but grass (no soy feed at all) and allowed to graze outside. Chickens again are allowed to roam outside and are grown longer with no soy feeds.
I eat a lot of eggs and again at £2 per 6 for eggs from my local farm (again no soy feed and chickens are allowed to graze naturally outside), it's not cheap.
Due to being on a low carb diet I can only eat green veggies, so for me it's mostly cauliflower, spinach, salad leaves (fond of rocket) and broccoli.
I buy a mixture of nuts for high fat snacks and in the form of dairy I only eat mozzarella / brie and double cream.
I don't eat much processed meat at all - the odd little bit of chorizo to add flavour but that's about it.
Caporegime
This is about....£1 - £1.50?
Off cut smoked Salmon and egg with rice. Probably the most expensive thing I would eat because of the Salmon. Total cost £5, £3-4 that is for the Salmon.
Make my own gyoza, can make like 50 at a batch with pork, chives, cabbage and onions. £1.50 a bowl?
Most of my meals are less than £2 per portion, if i am spending over £3 i have splashed out! I rarely buy steak or lamb.
Last edited:
Soldato
I explained what anti palm oil people are against, you called it angsty projection. Is the hang up because people that are against palm oil dont have a over arching name to classify them?
What part of cutting down rain forest that destroys the natural habitat of wild animals, flora and fauna as well as destroying a large part of CO2 absorbing natural plantation not slightly informed? Some of these rain forests have been around for 10s of thousands of years, once they are gone, thats it, along with the things that live in them. Oil palms tend to grow in areas of high humidity and high temperature, which is why the clearance of rain forest occurs.
Its this reason I think someone thought it rich that vegans mention being anti meat whilst using palm oil and its a valid point. You obviously seem to be happy on balance with the destruction for the gain in oil, some people dont think its worth it
Are you a bit upset this morning? You can have a civilised discussion without resorting to projection. The only reason I called it out is because anti-meat has a logical 'pro'. Being anti-palm oil is usually just people whinging after reading articles on Facebook.
Of course cutting down forests is bad, but where do you stop? Are you anti-housing? Are you anti-infrastructure in general?
It is such a stupid strawman you are bringing.
Soldato
Oh I get it, someone that doesnt agree with you, you have to post snide quips. Of course the non cutting down of rain forest is a logical pro. Im pretty sure you dont understand what a strawman is, I didnt make the initial claim, Im just trying to explain it. Im pretty sure it is you getting upset, which explains your snide comments
Caporegime
I went vegan for about 7 months, it was an interesting journey. Once you start down the rabbit hole of vegan activist YouTube videos it very hard to not be persuaded by their logical arguments. Ed Winters aka Earthling Ed is very good at debating/educating people on the topic.
I'm a dog lover and part of the reason I went vegan was because I saw value in all animal life - why a pig and not a dog, they are the same and in many cases smarter than dogs. I wouldn't want my dog to be treated like a pig.
My wife is a pescatarian and hasn't eaten meat in a long time so slowly I started eating some fish and sea food, even though I was aware of the damage fishing does. I also added diary back into the diet. The reason for my change was because as someone who is constantly busy and actively weight training I found the vegan diet very hard to get the right nutrients. I noticed my health and mental health were struggling with the constraints. Add in some IBS that doesn't agree with high fibre, I now eat some chicken too.
I'm a dog lover and part of the reason I went vegan was because I saw value in all animal life - why a pig and not a dog, they are the same and in many cases smarter than dogs. I wouldn't want my dog to be treated like a pig.
My wife is a pescatarian and hasn't eaten meat in a long time so slowly I started eating some fish and sea food, even though I was aware of the damage fishing does. I also added diary back into the diet. The reason for my change was because as someone who is constantly busy and actively weight training I found the vegan diet very hard to get the right nutrients. I noticed my health and mental health were struggling with the constraints. Add in some IBS that doesn't agree with high fibre, I now eat some chicken too.
You are now Completely mis quoting what I've said.
I'm not even vegan.
So you've misquoted and made an assumption.
You've also called me unhinged.
Soldato
I am a fan of Cornish pastis ,love the anaseed smell ,great with fresh orange juice or just on its own ,did a 70 cl bottle last month (yep I know)
So you have no point at all other than palm oil = bad? Good chat
Soldato
So you have no point at all other than palm oil = bad? Good chat
So lame, seriously. Perhaps you haven’t bothered looking what has happened and is happening for the ever increasing use of palm oil as it’s in so many things. The increasing use of it incentivises people to burn or destroy ever increasing amounts of rain forest to increase income. https://www.rainforest-rescue.org/topics/palm-oil/questions-and-answers
Caporegime
Bruh, you complain about a strawman, right after using a strawman yourself xD
But to answer your question, I am against cutting down the rainforest and destroying the natural habitats are many species purely to make palm oil (a non-essential thing).
I am not against grazing land that doesn't really have any other viable use, being used to raise cattle for slaughter.
I also believe it is possible to have development and infrastructure that tries to being at least somewhat harmonious with nature. Not pure concrete jungle, having wooded areas, wild flower colonies instead of sterile manicured lawn, etc. I've seen developments with hedgehog tunnels under their roads even.
Right boys, we are in violent agreement. I'm trying to transcend palm oil = bad, to something slightly more useful. It is used in almost 50% of consumer products. Life could not continue as it currently is without it. That 50% excludes its commercial uses, too.
Being lectured by someone that has read a Facebook article clearly not the path to get there though.
Being lectured by someone that has read a Facebook article clearly not the path to get there though.
Humans will always do damage. Its same as older people NIMBY older people moaning about house building but popping out kids.
Going vegan or even cutting down meat helps the environment. Consuming less, not having kids, dropping the car.
No one is expecting everyone to live in a box alone with no family.
But every bit does help.
For some reason it seems ingrained in society (both sides Of veganism) that it's all Or nothing.
Vegans belittling people who have cut down but aren't full.
Or omnivores saying "it's Pointless because you do X" (such as international travel)
Also bringing up "palm oil" etc isn't an argument that veganism isn't good. It's not compulsory you buy products with it in if you're a vegan.
Going vegan or even cutting down meat helps the environment. Consuming less, not having kids, dropping the car.
No one is expecting everyone to live in a box alone with no family.
But every bit does help.
For some reason it seems ingrained in society (both sides Of veganism) that it's all Or nothing.
Vegans belittling people who have cut down but aren't full.
Or omnivores saying "it's Pointless because you do X" (such as international travel)
Also bringing up "palm oil" etc isn't an argument that veganism isn't good. It's not compulsory you buy products with it in if you're a vegan.
Caporegime
I thought life not continuing as it currently is (ie. with most people eating meat) was the point?
Caporegime
That was never the point made, I brought it up as I found it funny/ironic that someone taking a dietary stance based on the welfare of animals would simultaneously use products that are bad for animals.
I feel the same way about a vegan who would choose to eat a vegan option from McDs/KFC, surely if you are steadfast enough to be vegan, you would be boycotting companies whose primary thing is selling meat products.
- Status