10GB vram enough for the 3080? Discuss..

[tommybhoy]

Like I said before if going to spout BS, expect to be corrected, hence why you and others can't come back with any kind of evidence or substance to debunk my points

Replicate that type of poly count scene, dense jungle, active RT'ing reflections, volumetric smoke, npcs interacting with the character, the canopy animations etc.

P.s

This is a merrygoround, and even I have my limits.

I'm not tagging anyone into this, he's probably read it, might not want to engage, that's why I haven't tagged him.

Your opinion isn't proof of anything before you blame it on system error, no matter how hard you try to spin your own opinion off as proof!

As I said, tiresome, I'm disagreeing with you, you have your opinion, I have my differing opinion, deal with it.

 

[Grim5]

I can't take the "RT vs no RT" debate seriously since I tried it on Control.

Both RT and baked-in lighting can vary A LOT depending on how the devs choose to implement either.

In Control, RT looks good and the baked-in lighting looks like one of the devs had their toddler code it on a "bring your kid to work" day. Baked-in lighting doesn't have to look like the absolute trash seen in Control with RT off.

You sound salty, meanwhile enjoying RT as always

 

[Twinz]

You sound salty, meanwhile enjoying RT as always

I call it like I see it, and the non-RT lighting in Control is equestrian excrement.

So now I take ravings I hear about RT with a pinch of salt. Call it "salty" if you like.

 

[chrcoluk]

I call it like I see it, and the non-RT lighting in Control is equestrian excrement.

So now I take ravings I hear about RT with a pinch of salt. Call it "salty" if you like.

What I have noticed is games that implement RT tend to do the bare minimal for non RT lighting which makes RT look like its some kind of godly feature, whether thats at Nvidia's request or because they feel they dont need to because RT does the job I dont know.

Someone on OCUK said last year that RT benefits devs more than the consumer, pre RT, lighting had to be added manually in the game which was very time consuming, RT been real time processed saves them a lot of that effort, so this would potentially explain why RT games have bad non RT lighting.

 

[Tired9]

That's normal and can be adjusted using the in-game video options or via the config file for the game.

The COD engine will use all available video memory, up until the maximum set using the options mentioned above.

You can set the game to use up to 100% of available video memory is so desired. Default (it varies depending on which COD game you play) is 80-85%. It can be adjusted up to 90% via video options or 100% using the config file. It can also be lowered to 70% using the video options, or even lower via the config file.

If you set it too low, the game starts rendering low quality textures in places rather than tanking FPS. There may be stuttering or hitching as you move around the world also.

His memory settings were at the lowest setting LtMatt.

I can bring you the thread.

https://forums.overclockers.co.uk/threads/is-8gb-of-vram-enough-for-the-3070.18903623/page-37

 

[Tired9]

I call it like I see it, and the non-RT lighting in Control is equestrian excrement.

So now I take ravings I hear about RT with a pinch of salt. Call it "salty" if you like.

I absolutely agree but at the same time I am thinking they need a blander base looking game for RT to take over and not mix effects...

 

[Grim5]

I call it like I see it, and the non-RT lighting in Control is equestrian excrement.

So now I take ravings I hear about RT with a pinch of salt. Call it "salty" if you like.

Control with RT looks awesome no two butts about it

 

[Wrinkly]

People also forget when comparing baked rasterisation to RT that the legacy route requries objects that do not move, that everything becomes indestuctable.

 

[Shaz12]

I can't take the "RT vs no RT" debate seriously since I tried it on Control.

Both RT and baked-in lighting can vary A LOT depending on how the devs choose to implement either.

In Control, RT looks good and the baked-in lighting looks like one of the devs had their toddler code it on a "bring your kid to work" day. Baked-in lighting doesn't have to look like the absolute trash seen in Control with RT off.

I agree. Cyberpunk IMO has the best implementation of rasterised lighting for an RT game. While RT does transform the image as expected, it’s at least comparable somewhat to the rasterised image. Then you have Dying Light 2 which IMO has the worst rasterised lighting I have seen. In the opening scene of the game, RT has an orangish tint over everything which is understandable given it’s evening but turn RTGI off and it feels like Dawn as that tint is completely gone. Sure feels the rasterised image should not be this bad. I saw the same thing in Deathloop opening scene. The RT image was so different, people actually thought the rasterised lighting was bugged.

 

[Grim5]

People also forget when comparing baked rasterisation to RT that the legacy route requries objects that do not move, that everything becomes indestuctable.

thats true, RT gives you real dynamic light allowing you to create dynamic assets and objects rather than old school static

 

[Nexus18]

Replicate that type of poly count scene, dense jungle, active RT'ing reflections, volumetric smoke, npcs interacting with the character, the canopy animations etc.

P.s

This is a merrygoround, and even I have my limits.

I'm not tagging anyone into this, he's probably read it, might not want to engage, that's why I haven't tagged him.

Your opinion isn't proof of anything before you blame it on system error, no matter how hard you try to spin your own opinion off as proof!

As I said, tiresome, I'm disagreeing with you, you have your opinion, I have my differing opinion, deal with it.

If only that video addressed and debunked all of the points I have been making...

But yes you are entitled to have your "own" take on it

What I have noticed is games that implement RT tend to do the bare minimal for non RT lighting which makes RT look like its some kind of godly feature, whether thats at Nvidia's request or because they feel they dont need to because RT does the job I dont know.

Someone on OCUK said last year that RT benefits devs more than the consumer, pre RT, lighting had to be added manually in the game which was very time consuming, RT been real time processed saves them a lot of that effort, so this would potentially explain why RT games have bad non RT lighting.

This.

Been a good few videos demonstrating the workflow for rasterization and RT implementation. 4a enhanced footage, which they shared with DF has probably been the best showcase so far, I can't find the video, as they have like 6 or more videos on metro now. Essentially, it saves times + effort which in return will save money and whilst I don't work in the "game" industry, working in the "development" industry, trust me, those things are priceless for all involved in projects hence why RT has really taken off even for consoles despite them lacking the grunt for it. It's rewards are pretty much the equivalent to having automation in the software development lifecycle.

People also forget when comparing baked rasterisation to RT that the legacy route requries objects that do not move, that everything becomes indestuctable.

Good point that.

I agree. Cyberpunk IMO has the best implementation of rasterised lighting for an RT game. While RT does transform the image as expected, it’s at least comparable somewhat to the rasterised image. Then you have Dying Light 2 which IMO has the worst rasterised lighting I have seen. In the opening scene of the game, RT has an orangish tint over everything which is understandable given it’s evening but turn RTGI off and it feels like Dawn as that tint is completely gone. Sure feels the rasterised image should not be this bad. I saw the same thing in Deathloop opening scene. The RT image was so different, people actually thought the rasterised lighting was bugged.

That scene in deathloop is a great example of rasterization limitations, DF explained it quite well in their coverage:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jWH1f9TeW0I&t=601s


When it comes to RT VS rasterization talk, I don't think a lot of people really get what to look for in RT which is evidenced by comments like "shinier reflections", a lot of the advantages come down to the way the environment changes with the light and shadow interactions etc.

2 games which don't get enough praise for its RT implementation are riftbreaker (which is fairly limited RT too) and the ascent (also fantastic games too).

e.g. look at how the environment changes in riftbreaker. It's why I always say, RT is best experienced for yourself in motion

Another good example of where you don't need to 300% zoom in to see the differences

 

[chrcoluk]

This.

Been a good few videos demonstrating the workflow for rasterization and RT implementation. 4a enhanced footage, which they shared with DF has probably been the best showcase so far, I can't find the video, as they have like 6 or more videos on metro now. Essentially, it saves times + effort which in return will save money and whilst I don't work in the "game" industry, working in the "development" industry, trust me, those things are priceless for all involved in projects hence why RT has really taken off even for consoles despite them lacking the grunt for it. It's rewards are pretty much the equivalent to having automation in the software development lifecycle.

Thanks.

I guess consumers would appreciate it more if these development cost savings were passed on with cheaper games, instead of the price hikes on games. Essentially as things stand now, consumers are having to buy RT hardware so the developer can save money.

The problem with the videos you linked which analyse RT is they always compare RT on/off in the same game, when we all know if these games were non RT the standard lighting would be much better implemented. I dont know the solution to this issue because you cant really compare one game to another, but every RT game I have seen, the non RT lighting is massively nerfed vs older games.

Also interestingly on deathloop, I think I prefer the visual quality mode, the ray trace mode has blurry shadows, loss of detail, and the lighting seems over exposed.

 

[Wrinkly]

Thanks.

I guess consumers would appreciate it more if these development cost savings were passed on with cheaper games, instead of the price hikes on games. Essentially as things stand now, consumers are having to buy RT hardware so the developer can save money.

We do benefit from RT with better looking and more dynamic environments, hence greater immersion. Would you ask Hollywood to go back to lengths of string and paper plates for the latest SiFi block buster?

 

[chrcoluk]

We do benefit from RT with better looking and more dynamic environments, hence greater immersion. Would you ask Hollywood to go back to lengths of string and paper plates for the latest SiFi block buster?

Ironically I dont like Hollywood movies with excessive cgi, and felt the 3d version of SAW was the worst of the series.

 

[Wrinkly]

Ironically I dont like Hollywood movies with excessive cgi, and felt the 3d version of SAW was the worst of the series.

I have to agree on the excessive CGI, which perfectly describes the legacy use of rasterisation. RT on the other hand is far more believable being
modled on how we perceive light.

 

[Poneros]

I can't take the "RT vs no RT" debate seriously since I tried it on Control.

Both RT and baked-in lighting can vary A LOT depending on how the devs choose to implement either.

In Control, RT looks good and the baked-in lighting looks like one of the devs had their toddler code it on a "bring your kid to work" day. Baked-in lighting doesn't have to look like the absolute trash seen in Control with RT off.

Control's actually one of the most advanced games in terms of raster lighting techniques, so on that front you're wrong if you think they didn't employ the best tech available for non-RT. If you're interested they have a whole bunch of talks on it & Quantum Break (from where they inherit a lot of the same tech). Where it does falter is that it was made, I think, with RT in mind and as such when it's raster-only it is prone to showcase more artifacts than other games might, this is particularly evident for their reflections because without RT they are incredibly noisy & grainy and just awful to look at, because they didn't limit what it applies to and how much (roughness etc). First time I played it I actually ended up turning off SSR entirely because outside of 4K it was just garbage (and I only had a Vega 64 then, so 4K wasn't on the cards). But again, it's not that they didn't use the best techniques available as much as it is that they tried to do something in a way where those techniques could never keep up with, but is perfect for RT.

 

[Twinz]

Control's actually one of the most advanced games in terms of raster lighting techniques, so on that front you're wrong if you think they didn't employ the best tech available for non-RT. If you're interested they have a whole bunch of talks on it & Quantum Break (from where they inherit a lot of the same tech). Where it does falter is that it was made, I think, with RT in mind and as such when it's raster-only it is prone to showcase more artifacts than other games might, this is particularly evident for their reflections because without RT they are incredibly noisy & grainy and just awful to look at, because they didn't limit what it applies to and how much (roughness etc). First time I played it I actually ended up turning off SSR entirely because outside of 4K it was just garbage (and I only had a Vega 64 then, so 4K wasn't on the cards). But again, it's not that they didn't use the best techniques available as much as it is that they tried to do something in a way where those techniques could never keep up with, but is perfect for RT.

I'm talking about the final product. I don't care if they used alien technology and infused it with unobtanium, it looks like crap. There was a spot where I was trying to climb over a wall of debris and noticed lava(?) Or something like it on the other side looked kind of cool (with RT on) I decided to try it without RT to see the difference and it was a joke. Looked like brightly colored play dough or something.

 

[EastCoastHandle]

Replicate that type of poly count scene, dense jungle, active RT'ing reflections, volumetric smoke, npcs interacting with the character, the canopy animations etc.

P.s

This is a merrygoround, and even I have my limits.

I'm not tagging anyone into this, he's probably read it, might not want to engage, that's why I haven't tagged him.

Your opinion isn't proof of anything before you blame it on system error, no matter how hard you try to spin your own opinion off as proof!

As I said, tiresome, I'm disagreeing with you, you have your opinion, I have my differing opinion, deal with it.

Wow, I didn't know it was that bad on the 3080. Thanks for posting.

 

[gpuerrilla]

Wow, I didn't know it was that bad on the 3080. Thanks for posting.

 

[Grim5]

Replicate that type of poly count scene, dense jungle, active RT'ing reflections, volumetric smoke, npcs interacting with the character, the canopy animations etc.

P.s

This is a merrygoround, and even I have my limits.

I'm not tagging anyone into this, he's probably read it, might not want to engage, that's why I haven't tagged him.

Your opinion isn't proof of anything before you blame it on system error, no matter how hard you try to spin your own opinion off as proof!

As I said, tiresome, I'm disagreeing with you, you have your opinion, I have my differing opinion, deal with it.

Wow that's bad, I guess 10gb isn't enough