Soldato
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^^^I was buying that until I saw he has a 750Ti. 
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DirectX 12
- Thread starter shankly1985
- Start date
^^^I was buying that until I saw he has a 750Ti.
He's renowned for his love of Nvidia on ocn. Kind of like the american version of Greg.
Not from what I have seen. The guy is a good guy and doesn't mince words and knows what he is talking about.
Even OCN is laughing at some of the people here
Alatar is a good man and talks some good sense
Alatar is considered one of the most biased moderators on OCN and that is by members at OCN, he is constantly getting called out for his bias.
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Its renowned Greg. Nonetheless though its all just opinions and everyone is entitled to one, so its all good.
Soldato
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- Cornwall
I do like that AMD employee on twitter when asked the question of if DX12 is Mantle says no.
An EA employee replys to a comment saying this looks a bit familiar with a "
".
From that we can tell that AMD are being coerced into lying to us because Microsoft are evil or something and that the EA guy told us that it is just Mantle renamed (and magically with Nvidia support) with the use of 3 characters.
This'll be why I can never figure out "Jonathon Creek" stories until the end as I'm just not good enough at reading between the lines and putting the piece of the puzzle together.
An EA employee replys to a comment saying this looks a bit familiar with a "
".From that we can tell that AMD are being coerced into lying to us because Microsoft are evil or something and that the EA guy told us that it is just Mantle renamed (and magically with Nvidia support) with the use of 3 characters.
This'll be why I can never figure out "Jonathon Creek" stories until the end as I'm just not good enough at reading between the lines and putting the piece of the puzzle together.
"DX12 and Mantle have similar features because that's what devs asked for."
AMD will have known what DirectX 12 has to offer for some time, probably before Mantle was released.
Maybe AMD couldn't wait, and "borrowed" a few ideas from DX 12 for their own API.
If so, I can see MS being a little ****** off.
Not that I give a **** personally.
AMD will have known what DirectX 12 has to offer for some time, probably before Mantle was released.
Maybe AMD couldn't wait, and "borrowed" a few ideas from DX 12 for their own API.
If so, I can see MS being a little ****** off.
Not that I give a **** personally.
I do like that AMD employee on twitter when asked the question of if DX12 is Mantle says no.
An EA employee replys to a comment saying this looks a bit familiar with a "
From that we can tell that AMD are being coerced into lying to us because Microsoft are evil or something and that the EA guy told us that it is just Mantle renamed (and magically with Nvidia support) with the use of 3 characters.
This'll be why I can never figure out "Jonathon Creek" stories until the end as I'm just not good enough at reading between the lines and putting the piece of the puzzle together.
I imagine you having a perm just like Mr Creek.
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See thats a interesting view and as valid as any
Personally dont agree as i'd imagine NDA breaching would have annoyed MS enough to sue etc but still interesting
Dirty rats AMD simply stealing others hard work...
See thats a interesting view and as valid as any
Personally dont agree as i'd imagine NDA breaching would have annoyed MS enough to sue etc but still interesting
Dirty rats AMD simply stealing others hard work...
HeHe, Yea, I don't give a damn about who got ideas from where, as long as the end product is OK (DX12).
As I've said mantle isn't going anywhere......DX12 will translate very easily into mantle.....
DX12 isn't for PC people need to understand this; this is to fix the Xbox1...its not hard to connect the pieces....
As I've said mantle isn't going anywhere......DX12 will translate very easily into mantle.....
DX12 isn't for PC people need to understand this; this is to fix the Xbox1...its not hard to connect the pieces....
I think you will find DX12 will be used on the pc platform aswell it wont be just for Xbox1
Kelper is based off Fermi......
Second check the code for DX12 and then check code for mantle; damn if DX12 doesn't just read damn close to what mantle is.
Guys seriously understand DX12 has nothing to do with PC; it has everything to do with fixed Xbox1 dev tools......
Now who can do that for MS now? *hint say with me boys and girls* its not Nvidia........its AMD......As I've said; back room deal; mantle is mantle; and DX12 is DX12....
DX12 code will translate easy into mantle; just like PS4 code translates into mantle easily.
Guess what and guess who's come to mantle.........Nvidia and Intel.....but wait its not mantle its DX12
Everyone wins.....with one api to rule them all
*BTW no I dont' have proof but this is what my contacts are telling exactly what happened*DX12 first and formost is being used to fix just how bad Xbox1 Dev tools are; MS needs this fix now; and not 2 years from now if they want to even stay close to PS4.
Its AMD's hardware in the Xbox1; AMD has the tools to fix this; so they did.....that's why DX12 code will translate easily into mantle.......just like PS4's code translates easily into mantle.
*Hint hardware in the codes is pretty much the same; specially with GCN* Again only reason this can happen; is happening is AMD rules consoles.......the consoles push gaming........and major uplift into PC field.
People are saying I'm mad; I'm not; all this information is coming to me from friends that are Developers and how are working with this stuff......
Well since mantle is so like PS4's coding we can simply take it that mantle was stolen of sony as your logic works right?
Sorry if i atm would rather believe AMD's own representative than someones who's friend told them this. Not saying your not right but atm i dont believe it
Caporegime
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I don't know if DX12 is simply Mantle, I don't even know if that is what Charlie's article says, headlines are one thing, the below the pay fold may say it more precisely as MS copies Mantle... I don't have a clue.
But IF MS incorporated and being MS, then MS would have paid to do so. If I worked at MS and I was paying another company to fix my slow ass API.... I would certainly not want them talking about it publicly, not least because getting Nvidia/Intel to publicly adopt it when AMD get to take credit would have been more difficult.
Ultimately in a couple years dev's will let people know what the differences are, today it's guess work(except for those with access to both), and who cares. I simply wouldn't take a twitter statement by the one group of people I would think would be contractually obliged to not say anything, as proof of anything.
As to DX, my take on it is simply this, for donkeys years MS kept putting out fixes that really didn't fix anything, work around's that complicated the code and offered very little real world benefit. They have been making a high level API for PC for donkeys years without a hint of a lower level API. AMD make a low level API and have been working on it for 2.5 years now(they said two years in November), this week MS have said they've been working on it for about a year and it has 18 months to go before DX12 games..... notice anything there, like, almost exactly same time frame as AMD but a year later on every milestone. DX was, for all intents and purposes, dead. DX being a high level API for Windows... DX12 isn't DX11 with added bits, it's something entirely new. If it had a new name and wasn't called DX< there would be no new version of DX as for 10+ years everyone recognised DX as being.
In terms of resources, it's incredibly unlikely that AMD threw anything other than minor resources at Mantle, and it's much more likely that MS has thrown 10x the resources at theirs, because AMD don't have cash and MS do. MS have an established "brand" (also why they are calling it DX12... though DX Performance or something would have worked), they have a department for DX. AMD didn't have an established API, they don't have 100's millions sitting around to hire 100 guys for a few years to work on something, they have peanuts and absolutely wouldn't risk a massive amount of money or man power on something that may never have ever made it into a release game.
But IF MS incorporated and being MS, then MS would have paid to do so. If I worked at MS and I was paying another company to fix my slow ass API.... I would certainly not want them talking about it publicly, not least because getting Nvidia/Intel to publicly adopt it when AMD get to take credit would have been more difficult.
Ultimately in a couple years dev's will let people know what the differences are, today it's guess work(except for those with access to both), and who cares. I simply wouldn't take a twitter statement by the one group of people I would think would be contractually obliged to not say anything, as proof of anything.
As to DX, my take on it is simply this, for donkeys years MS kept putting out fixes that really didn't fix anything, work around's that complicated the code and offered very little real world benefit. They have been making a high level API for PC for donkeys years without a hint of a lower level API. AMD make a low level API and have been working on it for 2.5 years now(they said two years in November), this week MS have said they've been working on it for about a year and it has 18 months to go before DX12 games..... notice anything there, like, almost exactly same time frame as AMD but a year later on every milestone. DX was, for all intents and purposes, dead. DX being a high level API for Windows... DX12 isn't DX11 with added bits, it's something entirely new. If it had a new name and wasn't called DX< there would be no new version of DX as for 10+ years everyone recognised DX as being.
In terms of resources, it's incredibly unlikely that AMD threw anything other than minor resources at Mantle, and it's much more likely that MS has thrown 10x the resources at theirs, because AMD don't have cash and MS do. MS have an established "brand" (also why they are calling it DX12... though DX Performance or something would have worked), they have a department for DX. AMD didn't have an established API, they don't have 100's millions sitting around to hire 100 guys for a few years to work on something, they have peanuts and absolutely wouldn't risk a massive amount of money or man power on something that may never have ever made it into a release game.
I told myself I wouldn't post in this thread again because of the amount of garbage and daft conspiracy theories being spouted but one last post won't hurt.
AMD have Mantle = Good for AMD guys and hopefully for the AMD guys, it will survive well and with the amount of devs on board, I see no reason it shouldn't. AMD can continue to pay devs to use it and should do. It took a couple of years (or more) to create and they should be proud of it.
DX12 is for nVidia, AMD and Intel (and Qualcomm), a 'universal API' if you like. The industry likes this and everyone gets to benefit from it. It might even be backwards compatible with W7, which would be sweet for some people (like me) but if not, so be it.
DX12 is able to run with current hardware and backwards compatible again, as far back as Fermi (Which is not even close to being based on Kepler Meldarthx) and sorry but not sure on AMD side of things. As for Intel, I honestly don't care about IGPU support and Intel users feel free to have a pop at me for that.
DX12 is good for us all but will be a fair while off and the AMD guys (who have been the most vocal about how crap/bad/stupid/it is Mantle in disguise) have the best of both worlds.
Surely everyone wins and the childish posting in here is being a bit pathetic? Ohhhh and for the record, I don't care what Xbox One uses as an API or a PS4 or a Wii U or a phone
AMD have Mantle = Good for AMD guys and hopefully for the AMD guys, it will survive well and with the amount of devs on board, I see no reason it shouldn't. AMD can continue to pay devs to use it and should do. It took a couple of years (or more) to create and they should be proud of it.
DX12 is for nVidia, AMD and Intel (and Qualcomm), a 'universal API' if you like. The industry likes this and everyone gets to benefit from it. It might even be backwards compatible with W7, which would be sweet for some people (like me) but if not, so be it.
DX12 is able to run with current hardware and backwards compatible again, as far back as Fermi (Which is not even close to being based on Kepler Meldarthx) and sorry but not sure on AMD side of things. As for Intel, I honestly don't care about IGPU support and Intel users feel free to have a pop at me for that.
DX12 is good for us all but will be a fair while off and the AMD guys (who have been the most vocal about how crap/bad/stupid/it is Mantle in disguise) have the best of both worlds.
Surely everyone wins and the childish posting in here is being a bit pathetic? Ohhhh and for the record, I don't care what Xbox One uses as an API or a PS4 or a Wii U or a phone
Caporegime
- Joined
- 18 Oct 2002
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You do realise it SPECIFICALLY says PROFESSIONAL segment, as in by far the smallest of any segments and utterly unrelated to gaming, completely.
The actual gpu's sold market share is Intel wins, AMD has around 20% and Nvidia around 16%, throw in consoles at maybe 20-25mil a year to AMD and that increases a decent amount.
Nvidia absolutely in no way is the market leader, they are by a margin the third biggest player in gpu sales, and a larger margin when talking about gaming specifically.
90%..... lol also for the record, AMD is eating into Nvidia's professional market share pretty fast.