"Our attempts to make Formula One greener is ruining the sport" - Bernie Ecclestone

[JHeaton]

Yes they probably would be slower. But we are not talking about V8s that are slower, we are talking about new "green" V6s that sound like leaf blowers being slower. The overall effect of this year's changes are happy engine manufacturers and a significant number of fans unhappy with what F1 has now become.

Your comment seems to give the impression that you think happy engine manufacturers isn't of great significance (please, feel free to correct me), but where would the sport be if all we were left with was Ferrari and Mercedes engines?

No other manufacturers showed any interest in getting into building F1 engines under the V8 regulations and one of the existing ones was unhappy with the situation. With the I4 idea floated, there were comments from a few new manufacturers (I think VW was one of them) about potential interest and Renault were fully prepared to invest in the new formula. Then we had the switch to turbo V6s and PURE started development, although ultimately that was unsuccessful and we are now awaiting the return of Honda. The previous situation could not last, as there just was not enough interest anymore. I'm not saying that V6s were the best solution, but we'd still be seeing problems if we stuck with the V8s.

You can talk up the new regulations all you like, unhappy fans equals less £££, and that is the only reason F1 exists. For that reason alone I am almost certain this year (and probably next) will be looked back on as the time F1 lost the plot. Hopefully someone will have enough sense to realise this before it's too late.

How would you suggest the situation is resolved?

 

[utajoker]

.... and yet still substantially slower overall. This years fastest lap at Malaysia was 4 seconds slower than last year. In F1 terms, that's enormous.

Brand new engines not being pushed for fear of early breakdown.
Not using the full rev limit for the above reason
Lift and coast to save fuel and fuel flow limiting.
Brand new cars that have almost 0 aerodynamic tweaking.
Drivers not pushing (Hamilton who set the fastest lap had his engine turned down even more than usual at that point in the race)

Vs

Virtually Bullet proof v8s pushed to the limits
Nth evolution cars that had minimal changes in regulations with almost maximum aerodynamic efficiency extracted

And only 4 seconds different in the 2nd race of the season.

They will be faster than last year by the end of the season.

 

[Spie]

How would you suggest the situation is resolved?

The problem is that there is a quantum difference between the requirements of the average saloon car engine and an F1 engine. Developing road car technology is all well and good, but not if it interferes with the principles of a racing car engine and not just any racing series, but the supposed pinnacle of motor racing, Formula 1.

There are many problems with Formula 1 today. It is far, far too regulated and yet what has this regulation achieved? The only real benefit I can think of is safety. Nobody cares about fuel flow rates when watching Formula 1. It's a ridiculous concept for the pinnacle of motorsport.

So what should be done? Go back a year, encourage development of new technology without destroying the appeal of the sport. Drop the fake Green credentials. Use engines made by either specialist independent companies or companies who make real sports cars. Learn from F1s history and find ways of making it more exciting again. That would be a start.

 

[V F]

Virtually Bullet proof v8s pushed to the limits
Nth evolution cars that had minimal changes in regulations with almost maximum aerodynamic efficiency extracted

And only 4 seconds different in the 2nd race of the season.

They will be faster than last year by the end of the season.

How, they were originally 19,000rpm in 2007. 2009 it was reduced to 18,000rpm. How often did you see an engine blow?

 

[DanielSon]

fia wanted 4 pot engines, so why not meet half way again?

4 cylinders routing through the turbo to produce the ers,

2 remaining cylinders straight out the bodywork to produce the sound every one wants

then up the fuel FLO limit to 130L/h or so to alow them to rev to 14,000+ during the race and 14,900 in quali

just a thought, 2016 maybe?

dan

 

[V F]

So what should be done? Go back a year, encourage development of new technology without destroying the appeal of the sport. Drop the fake Green credentials. Use engines made by either specialist independent companies or companies who make real sports cars. Learn from F1s history and find ways of making it more exciting again. That would be a start.

Hmm, reminds me of the interview on Sky Sports F1 thats been on for a while…

People complained about no overtaking. :s

 

[utajoker]

How, they were originally 19,000rpm in 2007. 2009 it was reduced to 18,000rpm. How often did you see an engine blow?

Not sure what your trying to do

I say they virtually bullet proof. You agree they almost never blow.

 

[dannyjo22]

Brand new engines not being pushed for fear of early breakdown.
Not using the full rev limit for the above reason.

Why would that be true?

They will have stressed those on test rigs far exceeding what they are currently doing on chassis.

 

[mmj_uk]

Hmm, reminds me of the interview on Sky Sports F1 thats been on for a while…

...

People complained about no overtaking. :s

This was a similar interview with him but a lot more off the cuff, probably before that one.

I'm completely in Irvine's corner.

Ted Cravitz reacts like Glaucus and a few others at the end and hits out at Eddie because he dared to criticize F1.

 

[V F]

Not sure what your trying to do

I say they virtually bullet proof. You agree they almost never blow.

Yeah, they never blew because they were dialled back and the ones that did, it was a gearbox collapse.


"Virtually Bullet proof v8s pushed to the limits"

You can't have both. It's either reliability or pushed to the limits with no margin for error and you'll get a blow up.

Look at the amount that blew up before and during 2006.

This was a similar interview with him but a lot more off the cuff, probably before that one.

I'm completely in Irvine's corner.


Ted Cravitz reacts like Glaucus and a few others at the end and hits out at Eddie because he dared to criticize F1.

Now that I think about it with past years of Bernie interviews on Sky, him always talking about Playstation. F1 really is like real life video games.

 

[ThundyCat]

I wonder if they'll overturn this rule for the start of next years F1 season when they discover how many fans have turned there backs on the sport.

 

[deuse]

I wonder if they'll overturn this rule for the start of next years F1 season when they discover how many fans have turned there backs on the sport.

To late as over 100 mil have already stopped watching F1 since 2009. 2008 was it's best year.

 

[Marvin]

So given that the main arguments against the new "green" engine formula are:

• they are too quiet
• they should be the pinnacle of motorsport
• the cars are too slow

Only one of those things might be true depending on subjective viewpoint.

Too quiet: fair enough, opinions are everyone's right. They could well reduce the number of viewers, though I'd imagine not really.
Pinnacle of motorsport: Name a modern on road racing series with more powerful engines.
The cars are too slow: quick enough that the top speeds are higher than last year, and the cars are a real handful out of corners, which suggests better acceleration.

So really, it's actually down to aero and tyres, which is something that everyone hates because it makes overtaking exceedingly difficult with loads of aero due to turbulence, and tyres which are fragile to the extreme preventing anyone from pushing.

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

F1 is so dire to watch, i can see myself turning off half way into the season like last year. There is just no action now it's like watching an opera really.

When i watch F1 i want to see screaming engines, cars being pushed to the limit always and exciting racing. Now when i watch it's like everyone has the same driving style and strategies. To much of it is written in stone and there is no unpredictability any more.

Like someone said above 2008 was the last good season in F1, 2012 was only a good year because the championship went down to the wire but it covered over the boring races.

The noise would not really bother me that much if the racing was exciting but due to the fact the racing is dull so far u cant help but notice the noise now and it's just not loud enough.

I say bring back V12's like others have said F1 going green wont change the world one bit, I wouldn't even mind that suggestion of 1 hour of racing as it will be more on the limit instead of this **** where u have to look after the tires and go into fuel saving mode.

Fuel saving should not be part of F1 i'm sorry but this is motor racing where people should be on the limit the whole times thats why it's called racing.

Ted Cravitz reacts like Glaucus and a few others at the end and hits out at Eddie because he dared to criticize F1.

Lol that is such sour grapes at the end there from Ted, it's like he personally insulted Ted with the way Ted reacted to it after Eddie walked off. Just because someone doesn't suck up to the camera's and gives an honest view of F1 Ted reacts badly to it imo.

 

[Skeeter]

I wonder if they'll overturn this rule for the start of next years F1 season when they discover how many fans have turned there backs on the sport.

You "wonder" of the FIA will change the engine format after 1 year, throwing all the money the 4 (including Honda) engine manufacturers have spent over the last 3 years down the drain, forcing all the teams to redesign cars from scratch for engines that won't exist because even the best manufacturer in the world can't design a new engine in 6 months, while making themselves look like fools and costing the teams millions?

You genuinely wonder if that will happen? Really?

 

[hillbilly2]

What sort of boost do these new engines run?

 

[Skeeter]

Technically I think its unlimited, but restricted to about 3.5 bar due to the fuel flow limit.

 

[Glaucus]

I say bring back V12's like others have said F1 going green wont change the world one bit, I wouldn't even mind that suggestion of 1 hour of racing as it will be more on the limit instead of this **** where u have to look after the tires and go into fuel saving mode.

Fuel saving should not be part of F1 i'm sorry but this is motor racing where people should be on the limit the whole times thats why it's called racing.

And this is where you and many others simply don't understand and come up with stupid suggestions.
V12, v10, v8 will not solve any issue other than noise.

In no way are any off those engines technologically cutting edge, that is hybrids where the electric fills in the ICE shortfalls and the ICE fills in the electric shortfalls.

F1 is about fuel saving and you will never go back to when it wasn't as teams no far more now than they did in the golden age.
The simple fact is that fuel weight is to big a penalty, that can not be made up through fast driving.
So your v12 just like last years v8 will have fuel saving, regardless of the rules, as it's the fastest way to complete the race.

So yeah terrible idea there, which only solves the sound issue you mentioned and nothing else.

 

[One]

Just ditch night races with the hugely fuel expensive floodlights and the savings would allow them to use as much fuel as they wanted.

 

[Glaucus]

Just ditch night races with the hugely fuel expensive floodlights and the savings would allow them to use as much fuel as they wanted.

Which they won't as it is not the fastest way to complete the race, this is not new this year.
Same as this year, it doesn't look like any of the mercy teams where running the full fuel limit.
Just like last however many years they have been fuel limited despite the lack of a fuel limit rule.

F1 is also carbon neutral as well and has been for years probably decade or so now.

as usual fans not having a clue. Whivh is understandable for casual viewers but many in this thread aren't. and yet you seem totally oblivious to the last 30years of f1