Scottish Elections Result

[Biohazard]

You make the insinuation that 200 business leaders would vote for an independant Scotland.

I think given their strong support, I wouldn't say it is too far off the mark, no. But it isn't a direct endorsement, no. More indirect.

It doesnt mean anything of the sort. I have been happy with the SNP in the last term, I was happy to vote for them in this election but as a business owner and someone who employs 14 people, I DONT want an independant Scotland.

It all rather depends on your business and fears regarding seperation to be honest with you..

By voting for SNP it doesnt mean you agree that independance is the way forward, all it means is having a vote and letting the people decide once and for all what they want and then hopefully nationalist morons can stop banging on that its what everyone wants.

If you are talking from the non business electorate point of view I agree there are some curious disconnects that take place in Scottish/UK elections and voting practices/intentions as result of the field.

However, I would add that the nationalists aren't morons for banging on that's what everyone wants; there has been clear support for a referendum as shown by polls (even from Labour for all of 2 days before a U-U-U-turn).

Just not independence.

 

[jas72]

I suppose it depends what you do for a living really, if you are in business an independant Scotland would only be a bad thing, if you sit and home picking up your dole and thinking all day about how England have brought Scotland down then it might seem like a good idea at the time, but when you then realise your state life wont be anywhere near as comfortable and your free health care and prescriptions and education has to end you would probably change your tune as we dont have the resourses to be a country in our own right.

Source for this?

I think Scotland has plenty of resources and the possiblity to put these resources to good use if they have to.

However I still think Scotland's devolution is too young to be thinking of independence. Give us 20-30 years more power and let it happen slowy and more naturally as part of a wider UK split. I'd prefer to see the UK become more federal with central government taking more of a national role and the north and midlands also having some form of working government.

 

[Metalface Mark]

I dont have any problem with a referendum and if a majority of Scottish public vote for it (not the majority of people voting) then so be it, the problem is its not a burning issue for most people in the country (how many people even bothered to vote for devolution compared to the overall electorate).

The problem the SNP have with independance, they expect to be able to just march off with the North Sea oil because its in Scottish waters and im sure it wont be any where as easy as that, we goto war with Iraq and Afghanistan over oil yet Salmond expects Westminster to just roll over and have its tummy tickled when it comes to north sea oil, its not going to happen.

 

[Metalface Mark]

Source for this?

I think Scotland has plenty of resources and the possiblity to put these resources to good use if they have to.

However I still think Scotland's devolution is too young to be thinking of independance. Give us 20-30 years more power and let it happen slowy and more naturally as part of a wider UK split. I'd prefer to see the UK become more federal with central government taking more of a national role and the north and midlands also having some form of working government.

Taking oil out of the equation, what resourses do Scotland have to support the country?

 

[Raumarik]

SNP are doing well partly down to their leadership in Scotland, when you look at all of the other parties, they have nothing to offer. Like it or not Salmond is at least a personality who speaks his mind, the others tend to be looking south for opinions before opening their mouths.

I've never actually voted SNP but I was incredibly tempted to this time.

 

[Biohazard]

I dont have any problem with a referendum and if a majority of Scottish public vote for it (not the majority of people voting) then so be it, the problem is its not a burning issue for most people in the country (how many people even bothered to vote for devolution compared to the overall electorate).

That is a poor comparison to be honest with you. If people couldn't be bothered voting either way, they don't count.

The problem the SNP have with independance, they expect to be able to just march off with the North Sea oil because its in Scottish waters and im sure it wont be any where as easy as that, we goto war with Iraq and Afghanistan over oil yet Salmond expects Westminster to just roll over and have its tummy tickled when it comes to north sea oil, its not going to happen.

Yes we would technically and oil is just a fraction of the case; and England would not invade Scotland for claiming its own resources.

 

[Raumarik]

Taking oil out of the equation, what resourses do Scotland have to support the country?

Rocks and trees and waaaater. Much like an "arrogant worms" song I remember from years ago about Canada

Oil and Gas aside it'd all come down to people power, which due to the number of folk claiming benefits would see us sink rather quickly.

 

[Metalface Mark]

That is a poor comparison to be honest with you. If people couldn't be bothered voting either way, they don't count.

Everyone counts, if someone doesnt vote for independance then their vote should be counted as not wanting it. you should need a clear majority of people wanting it to be the case.

Yes we would technically and oil is just a fraction of the case; and England would not invade Scotland for claiming its own resources.

Im not saying England would invade Scotland of course thats ridiculous, but why should England instantly lose out because of a vote? There would be agreements put in place more than likely to split the oil revenues which would put a big hole in the proposed budgets of an independant Scotland.

 

[afraser2k]

Great result in my constituency of Glasgow Anniesland with SNP winning by seven votes. Finally after years of New Labour we might get some change here and good to see the LibDems humiliated as well.

 

[Biohazard]

Everyone counts, if someone doesnt vote for independance then their vote should be counted as not wanting it. you should need a clear majority of people wanting it to be the case.

You need a clear majority of those who take part in the franchise; to set such undemocratic terms are very very unlikely in the Scottish parliament.

Im not saying England would invade Scotland of course thats ridiculous, but why should England instantly lose out because of a vote?

So England is the net beneficiary then?

Nice of you to say so.

There would be agreements put in place more than likely to split the oil revenues which would put a big hole in the proposed budgets of an independant Scotland.

Why would Scotland give away it's resource? I very much doubt that would be in the negotiations, and oil revenues are only part of the economic case.

 

[Biohazard]

Great result in my constituency of Glasgow Anniesland with SNP winning by seven votes. Finally after years of New Labour we might get some change here and good to see the LibDems humiliated as well.

I genuinely hope this can bring some change for Glasgow too.

For far too long Labour have taken your cities support for granted while ignoring the problems at the same time to propel themself towards Westminster.

It ended last night.

 

[RDM]

We might see a referendum on independence this term but I've got my suspicions we won't as I'm not sure if there's enough of popular opinion to make it likely of success and Alex Salmond being the good politician that he is would know that to offer it and have it batted down would be very damaging. I'd expect it within the next ten years or so if the SNP continue to do a decent job and gain in popularity but maybe not this term.

Seems that Salmond may be pressing ahead with it this term, at least that is what seemed to be the impression I got of a small snippet of a speech from him. (After I asked the question on the boards). Maybe he is hoping the groundswell of support for the SNP is also a show of support for independance?

Then there's a question of whether I'd want a referendum this term - I'd like to see a referendum as it should hopefully settle the issue one way or the other.

Following that there's the question of the result - I'd prefer to see Scotland remain as part of the Union as I think that overall the whole country is better together. However if the majority wanted independence then I'm sure Scotland would survive and even prosper in the longer term, I suspect that it would initially be rather difficult and fraught but there's a decent chance that a success could be made of it.

Not being Scottish I do not really have a say in the matter, I personally think that we would be better of as we are but there are decent arguments to be made either way. I have no doubt that Scotland will be able to cope, but I do not think it would be as strong as it would be as part of the union. I think there are also massive welfare and state dependancy issues that would need to be seriously addressed, more so than the UK as a whole (but possibly less than the North East).

I'm undecided on the issue of whether England/Wales/Northern Ireland should get any say in independence for Scotland, the breakup of a union in national terms as in matrimony affects a number of other parties so in some ways it would seem fairest if there could be some consensus - is it a no fault divorce with all parties wanting the split and therefore potentially affecting the division of assets or is it to be a unilateral divorce which means that one party may be more prejudiced in the division?

I am not sure if it is anything to do with the rest of the nation to be honest. If the Scottish people as a whole desire independance that should be it. I would however expect the remaning UK to bargain as hard as possible in any settlement as they would be representing the rest of the UKs interests and not Scotlands.

 

[Metalface Mark]

Why would Scotland give away it's resource? I very much doubt that would be in the negotiations, and oil revenues are only part of the economic case.

Ill turn it around on you, why would the remainder of Britain give away its resource that it currently enjoys?

As for undemocratic terms, these were the very terms from the election in the 70's.

 

[Biohazard]

Ill turn it around on you, why would the remainder of Britain give away its resource that it currently enjoys?

Upon independence it wouldn't be Britain's any longer, and as we stand it is still Scotland's oil on the whole anyway, even after the theft of 6000 square miles of Scottish North Sea to England..

Britain wouldn't be giving anything, Scotland would be reclaiming.

Who cares what britain thinks or wants in this scenario? It really isn't the issue at hand.

As for undemocratic terms, these were the very terms from the election in the 70's.

Election?

You mean the '79 referendum?

 

[Ahleckz]

So, what have I missed?

Conservatives have lost a few seats, but we should be able to get a few more in the List - we always do much better in there.
SNP still storming ahead, really no surprise.

 

[Ahleckz]

Pirate Party, woo. Got a friend who is running for them.

 

[Raumarik]

Upon independence it wouldn't be Britain's any longer, and as we stand it is still Scotland's oil on the whole anyway, even after the theft of 6000 square miles of Scottish North Sea to England.. QUOTE]

Remember that after independence (which I don't support incidentally) Scotland could lodge a claim to the UN regarding that "lost" territory and frankly would more than likely win, unlike Argentina's claim on territory surrounding the Falkland Islands, Scotland does have a strong claim.

 

[Biohazard]

Taking oil out of the equation, what resourses do Scotland have to support the country?

So apart from oil, Scotland is a basket case economy is it?

Given you yourself run a business, surely you must be able to open your eyes more than Scotland's only resource is oil?

If you genuinely have to ask, I'm shocked your in business so to speak.

 

[RDM]

Remember that after independence (which I don't support incidentally) Scotland could lodge a claim to the UN regarding that "lost" territory and frankly would more than likely win, unlike Argentina's claim on territory surrounding the Falkland Islands, Scotland does have a strong claim.

It depends, does that sort of claim go anywhere near the Security Council? If so then the chances of claiming could be significantly reduced.

 

[Ahleckz]

Do we think with an SNP majority we will be seeing the referendum on independance this term?

Of course we will, but it's not going to happen until the very end of the term and it won't go through.