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** The AMD Navi Thread **

Discussion in 'Graphics Cards' started by subbytna, Aug 20, 2017.

  1. Poneros

    Mobster

    Joined: Feb 18, 2015

    Posts: 3,070

    4 Years is not really a long time, and besides, even the 1080 ti almost doubles 980 ti performance, especially at 4K & especially in modern built games that take advantage of async & dx12/vulkan. Sometimes it doesn't, but those are the older games & the exceptions. More importantly, you often fall below even the 30 fps threshold at 4K with a 980 ti, so the gains from an upgrade are even more important than just going from 60 to >100.

    https://youtu.be/--UHIlV11wg?t=321

    https://youtu.be/7gUOaxMxowI

     
  2. nashathedog

    Sgarrista

    Joined: Sep 12, 2013

    Posts: 8,551

    Location: Knowhere

    I don't think anyone should be expecting much from Navi, Back when people were saying Zen'll be make or break for AMD they were also saying we need Zen to succeed to allow AMD to pour funds into RTG so they can get back on track and develop a new architecture & Navi isn't that new architecture, Navi was already being developed on a tight budget using GCN again so we shouldn't be expecting big things from Navi, We know GCN has limitations, we knew it would take several years to feel the knock on effect from the increased R&D budget Zen could offer yet here we are with people expecting miracles, setting themselves up to be disappointed & it won't be AMD's fault this time it'll be theirs.
     
  3. LePhuronn

    Mobster

    Joined: Sep 26, 2010

    Posts: 3,915

    Location: Stoke-on-Trent

    I don't think anybody was. Midrange Polaris replacement nice and small, nice and cheap. The original AdoredTV leak just played to that narrative and we were all content with an aggressive stance to bring (or at least attempt) the midrange market under control with solid performance and sane pricing.

    Then all this fud about Navi 20 taking on the 2080Ti, Navi has ray tracing, PS5 has ray tracing, showed up and it's distorted the picture so much expectations are running rampant.

    Fully concur and have said the same myself many times. Yes I have logical, yet idealistic, beliefs on how AMD should price Navi and I will be disappointed if (when) AMD try and charge Nvidia money because I'll see it as a bit of self-delusion and a wasted opportunity. But if any chump honestly believes Navi was ever going to be more than Vega 64 +15% performance then the disappointment is entirely of their own making.
     
  4. TNA

    Capodecina

    Joined: Mar 13, 2008

    Posts: 10,803

    Location: London

    Exactly. Navi is Raja's baby :p

    Never expected anything from Navi myself. I am looking a lot more forward to what Nvidia will offer at 7nm if I am being honest. AMD won't be back in the gpu game the way we want until 2021 probably. What I am looking forward to from AMD is zen 2 :D
     
  5. Martini1991

    Caporegime

    Joined: Sep 18, 2009

    Posts: 27,482

    Location: Dormanstown.

    When Vega 64 had a mediocre launch, everyone said "WAIT FOR NAVI".
    Now Navi's around the corner it's "Oh no, wait for the next gen!"
     
  6. Grim5

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Feb 6, 2019

    Posts: 1,273

    Next gen for AMD is called Arcterus
     
  7. Martini1991

    Caporegime

    Joined: Sep 18, 2009

    Posts: 27,482

    Location: Dormanstown.

    "Wait for Arcterus"
     
  8. ANDREW GREEN

    Hitman

    Joined: Sep 17, 2018

    Posts: 510

    So after having a little think about this, I think full fat Navi XT is going to get close to 2080 performance. That's why we got leaked a 295 Watt beast and why the Sapphire rep stated there is going to be a water cooled version. No water cooled Radeon 7 but there will be a water cooled Navi XT, what does that say? That Radeon 7 isn't the flagship and that Navi XT absolutely is. It also clear that Navi XT has to be an enthusisast part. And a water cooled Navi Xt has to be hitting 2080 levels to make it worthwhile, doesn't it?

    Navi XT doesn't 'compete' with 2070, it surpasses it. So that drops it's performance squarely between 2070 and 2080 and maybe closer to 2080 if it is so obviously surpassing it.

    So Navi Pro is between a 2060 and 2070 - we don't really know what this means but it kind of needs to be close to 2070 to justify the $399 price point. And with some fine wine, it may match 2070 at 399 in time. Which makes it a good card.

    None of this should be surprising because AMD have been competitive from £100-£350 for 12 months but they haven't been competitive between £350-£500 since the 2070 and 2060 releases. This makes AMD competitive in that bracket. It can release smaller Navi 12 parts when Vega and Polaris series go out of stock
     
  9. BigBANGtheory

    Hitman

    Joined: Apr 21, 2007

    Posts: 608

    That's not true across the board though is it, take something more popular like GTA V and you'll not see that.
     
  10. ANDREW GREEN

    Hitman

    Joined: Sep 17, 2018

    Posts: 510

    You will see more than double at 4k, including GTA5, which is 88 vs 40 at 4k and 78 vs 158 at 1440p

    I can ofcourse understand people who don't count the 2080ti because of it's price
     
  11. Grim5

    Wise Guy

    Joined: Feb 6, 2019

    Posts: 1,273

    I wouldn’t have a clue since basicallyre every reviewer already removed gta v from benchmarking because it’s a game from 2013 and has a poor reflection on newer hardware
     
  12. LePhuronn

    Mobster

    Joined: Sep 26, 2010

    Posts: 3,915

    Location: Stoke-on-Trent

    That's because we didn't know Navi was still going to be GCN.
     
  13. Sargatanas2511

    Mobster

    Joined: Oct 26, 2013

    Posts: 2,984

    Location: Scotland

    Arcturus is probably not next gen, it was originally the codename for a single chip(rumoured to be the next Xbox chip) and everyone started assuming it's the next gen architecture.

    There is absolutely no confirmation from AMD that it's anything more than a chip design.
     
  14. nashathedog

    Sgarrista

    Joined: Sep 12, 2013

    Posts: 8,551

    Location: Knowhere

    Same here, I'm already on a 2700x which isn't that old but if we get a high clocked 12 core that offers a respectable gaming improvement at an acceptable price I'll be upgrading that again, I'm not in a rush to upgrade my GPU so like you I'll see if Nvidia offer anything that interests me & if not maybe Intel will in 2021. :)
     
  15. nashathedog

    Sgarrista

    Joined: Sep 12, 2013

    Posts: 8,551

    Location: Knowhere

    The vocal few maybe not everyone, From the start a lot of people saw it as Navi was going to replace Polaris in the line-up not replace Vega, ie: the high end, if they manage to match the Vega 56 & 64 that's great but it was never going to be much better than that.
     
  16. Martini1991

    Caporegime

    Joined: Sep 18, 2009

    Posts: 27,482

    Location: Dormanstown.

    Vega 64 is 2 years old now.
    It needs replacing and obviously vega vii isn't that replacement.

    If Navi comes in at a price point higher than the current pricing of vega stuff it's not right to say its a polaris replacement.
     
  17. Scougar

    Capodecina

    Joined: Jan 30, 2007

    Posts: 12,099

    Location: PA, USA

    I waited purely because I didn't want to get in a situation of paying 500+ only to be able pay 250 for the same perf with Navi. Seems like that might not be the case though..shame.
     
  18. JediFragger

    Capodecina

    Joined: Oct 18, 2002

    Posts: 20,958

    Location: Stoke-on-Trent

    AMD in wanting to make money shock :eek:
     
  19. Troezar

    Mobster

    Joined: Aug 6, 2009

    Posts: 3,308

  20. AthlonXP1800

    Mobster

    Joined: Sep 28, 2014

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    Location: Scotland

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