If you love your partner you're not sat there wondering if the grass is greener. You're basically just deciding if you can tolerate your life as it currently is forever by settling with the relationship you have, or do you have the balls to go through with the turmoil and practicalities of a break up and then the possibility of being on your own for a while.
The OcUK Relationship Counselling and Hugs Thread
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If you love your partner you're not sat there wondering if the grass is greener. You're basically just deciding if you can tolerate your life as it currently is forever by settling with the relationship you have, or do you have the balls to go through with the turmoil and practicalities of a break up and then the possibility of being on your own for a while.
The data doesn't seem to tally with your feelings though
Why Are Lone-Parent Families Declining in the UK?
Play around with the annual UK survey data on Families and Households released in February by the UK Office for National Statistics, and you find an extraordinary thing: the proportion of lone-parent families in 2020 is now down to levels not seen since the 1990s.
ifstudies.org
Other interesting stats from Gingerbread, an organisation focused on single parent families
The data doesn't seem to tally with your feelings though
Why Are Lone-Parent Families Declining in the UK?
Play around with the annual UK survey data on Families and Households released in February by the UK Office for National Statistics, and you find an extraordinary thing: the proportion of lone-parent families in 2020 is now down to levels not seen since the 1990s.
Other interesting stats from Gingerbread, an organisation focused on single parent families
I saw this before, what are the chances they didn't include families from ethnic backgrounds or focused more on the caucasian families. Because from my background (being ethic) Single parent households and single mothers is BIG problem in my community and has been for years. It's not declining from what we see in our everyday lives.
Being 40 years old myself. Apart from 2 people, all of my friends who had kids, non of them are still with their partners they had kids with or even got married to them.
I'm sure if look at your own friends and families, people you went to school with, work with. If they have kids, I bet most of them are no longer with partners they had kids with. Including people who had kids by multiple partners.
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I'm on my phone now, but from the gingerbread site they did split single households into ethnic background in 1 chart and the majority is from white households (~80-90% iirc), which you would expect, being the largest demographic in the country anyway.
That's true, but just because you've broken up with the other biological parent doesn't automatically mean you will end up a single parent statistic, as they will be in new relationships.
Soldato
It can often take something dark, for us to take the time to look within and understand ourselves better. It's not about changing yourself for anyone, but yourself and accepting yourself, too. You, as we all are, imperfect souls. We're not aiming for perfection, as it doesn't exist, and moreover, we can only see life and people through the small lens that we have. This is based on our own experiences and emotions.
All we can do is learn to love who we are, for us. Things didn't workout and that is sad. I felt the same. But it can also be a catalyst for good, too. An opportunity to understand yourself, learn to embrace life and the change that comes with it. "The only constant in life is change" is the saying, and we get so comfortable that change scares us, but change is whatever you want it to be. Nothing takes away from the great times had, and nothing stops even greater times to come, except ourselves, if we let it.
Sending love.
Soldato
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That's very true, and I am much happier with the person I am today than the person I was 10 years ago when my relationship with my son's mum ended, or even 6 years ago when I had a break down and first went for counselling. I have grown so much as a person and continue to do so. It's been incredibly hard at times but the change has been wonderful. I feel so sad because the things that my ex has come to see that she wants and needs are the things I have been working towards for myself for so long and to have come so far as I have but for it to not have been quite enough, really hurts; and leaves me with so many 'what ifs'. What if I had pushed myself harder in my therapy etc. I know those are questions to which there is no answer but I know they will haunt me for a good long while.
I am so proud of how I have coped since the relationship ended because it is so different to how I was when my last relationship ended. Back then I was consumed with addiction and serial dating with not a single good intention, and that did me so much harm and led me to spiralling downwards and into a breakdown. This time I have reached out to friends and my counsellor for support, and have joined MeetUp to try to meet new people for nothing more than company and friendship, I've put everything of mine aside when I've needed to in order to be a good father to my son who is struggling, have continued to work hard at my job and have continued to see my clients as a counsellor. I know I'm doing good things, and I know in time things will get better and I will feel better but at present that doesn't stop me struggling to get to sleep, or waking up early with nothing but painful thoughts filling my head.
In time I know I will be able look back with fondness for the relationship I had, and the person who I love so dearly (if I didn't and it hadn't been such a happy relationship, I wouldn't feel as I do now) and the happy memories we made together.
Sending love back to you and to anyone and everyone that wants or needs it.
Soldato
But you're trying to be something she wants you to be in this statement and if she's not able to accept you for you, no matter what stage of your progress you are, that's on her, not you. We don't improve ourselves for the acceptance of others, but to live our best lives.
A book I'm reading at the moment is called the power of now, and it's a really good one for simply "Being". The fact that we are not our thoughts. Our consciousness and mind are separate and when you decouple those and observe your thoughts and think hmmm that's an interesting one, rather than it sending us into emotions, it helps us break away from what often drives us, which is our minds (hence not sleeping, overactive thoughts etc)
Soldato
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Yeah I get that, but truthfully the things she wanted are also the things I want for myself and have been working towards to make my life happier. I shall continue to work on them because it's what I want for me and ultimately they will help me be a better version of me which I will like more and who knows, in time maybe someone else will like that version too.... not that I have any intention of looking right now!
Sounds like an interesting book, I shall seek it out.
Forgive me if I'm wrong pal, but it sounds like what you're saying here and in previous posts is that you used to be "the bad boy" found your ex, got married? And became the nice guy and the relationship ended etc?
I'm not being flippant, I'm genuinely intrigued. See I've had difficulties of my own in my current relationship after becoming disabled and the Dynamic changing. She left for a few days several months ago, needing space because of the stress surrounding my daughter from a previous relationship. That made me realise that my relationship wasn't as solid as I thought and while I still love her very much I'm trying to improve myself and become as independent as possible in case it does end. What's interesting is while things are far from perfect we feel stronger than before.
Soldato
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Oh no, it wasn't like that, in the distant past, without realising it, I was selfish, inconsiderate, lazy, chaotic, disorganised negative and I lacked empathy and kindness, in a lot of ways I loathed myself and I was deeply unhappy. I was in a relationship with the mother of my son and I can see why things didn't work out because I wasn't a great partner.
Ten years ago when I split up with my son's mum, I began to see how I was and with a lot of self-reflection, painful emotional work and counselling, I started to grow so much as a person and re-found my empathy, kindness, self-worth and self-respect and worked really hard to be more positive and to see the good in everything around me. I developed gratitude, grew in confidence and worked really hard to become a person that I could look at in the mirror and think "you're a decent person and you're good enough" I was so much happier, I was at peace in my own company, I took up dancing and made friends who I valued, and who valued me (something I had been sorely lacking).
Roll forward 7 years to the summer of 2020, I was worlds away from the person I had been, I was kind, caring, considerate, empathic, and far more positive than I had ever been. I had a sense of purpose (I was training to become a counsellor, inspired by the life-changing impact my counselling had had on me), I was a much better parent and a good friend, and a nice person.
It was that version of me who met someone amazing, who liked me for who I was and who I adored and wanted to spend all my time with. We were together until she ended the relationship at the end of November. She had her reasons, (I was too negative, not motivated enough, not organised etc) and I can see that compared to how she is, she is right I'm not as driven, positive and organised etc as her, and I can understand how she found that hard to cope with as she felt she had to be the one who was all of those things and needed to take on the role of helping me to be them too.
What hurts me so much is that I am still working on myself and growing as a person and improving in all the areas that I know I struggle with, and I know in time I would have become that person she wanted. Not for her sake but for my own because that's who I want to be.
Just one example which has helped me to explain it to my counsellor. Imagine plotting your outlook on life on a scale of 1 to 10. 1 being completely pessimistic and negative and 10 being incredibly optimistic and positive. She is a 9 on the scale. Ten years ago I was about a 2, and with all the work I've put in on myself, now I'm about a 6. But she had realised she needs and wants an 8. Does that make sense?
(sorry, clearly some stuff that needed to come out there, sorry for the long post)
Soldato
The thing I learned was to not try and apply logic to any of her words or actions, none of it will make sense.
Women are emotionally driven so to us its all nonsense.
Not every woman is the same though. I'm quite emotionally driven. But it's not a bad thing.
Applying logic is what I have been doing. That and trying to make sense of a senseless position. For now I’m going to do my own thing. She is in the house tonight with me to see the kids as she travels Friday at 4am. I’ve stayed away and sorted through old paperwork for shredding. Leaving her to her space.
On a brighter note. Had first invoice from solicitors. £480 for a 45 min meeting and 2 emails…
On a brighter note. Had first invoice from solicitors. £480 for a 45 min meeting and 2 emails…
I'm in the wrong job!
You think that's bad, I recently got stung for £150 for less than 10 seconds work by a locksmith after my daughter locked us out the house.
@413x No, not all women are the same but when talking in general, those who are less so tend to be the exception rather than the rule. You're right though, naturally there is nothing wrong with this.
@ShadowMan Believe me, I've been there! Trying to apply logic to something that has happened due to emotion. Stuff never makes sense in those terms because it can't, it's like trying to mix oil and water.
That said us men clearly make decisions based on emotion too.
![[FnG]magnolia](/styles/overclockers/avatars/9.png){kind=avatar}
Caporegime
Gents/Ladies - some older words of perhaps wisdom for you to reflect on. This is an abridged version and hopefully the swear filter will keep me from the gulag.
"To the dumped and dumpers alike, welcome to the Breakup Megathread. If you’re starting to suspect an end to your romantic world as you know it, it just ended, or you’re five months down the road and it’s all coming back to haunt you, hopefully this thread and the people in it can give you some useful advice to avoid those pesky restraining orders. But before we get too far along:
Lushka16’s Breakup Megathread Theorem: Every one of you will invariably cherry-pick, feel a compulsion to ignore or otherwise neglect most or all of the fantastic advice detailed below, assuming it doesn’t apply to you.
Minimaul’s Megathread Corollary: You are not a special *********. You are not the exception to the rule. You are not the anecdote that proves the rule wrong. You are not in a Jennifer Aniston movie. You are not a movie with an acceptable ending for the whole audience. This is life.
All right. What's next? Everyone loves phases. For any breakup, there are three main phases: Premonition, Breakup, and Post Breakup. This guide holds your hand through each phase and provides a plethora of prescriptions to help you past the Post Breakup phase and beyond.
The Premonition Phase
Ever felt like your boyfriend or girlfriend is acting distant or uninterested in a way that’s getting under your skin? Do they seem to pick at everything you do, spend much of their energy finding ways to be away from you, or are no longer interested in sex or physical intimacy? You are probably in the premonition phase as they (or you) consider the reasonableness of breaking up. During this time you may feel a lack of communication and uncertainty—basically hell—in the relationship.
But wait! Nothing is inevitable. Couples have problems, and many can be worked out with a little effort as long as you don’t sabotage yourself. How to avoid that, you ask? I’m glad you asked!
How to Not Sabotage Yourself:
The Breakup Phase
So you’ve found yourself in an irreconcilable romantic affair and those fateful words are on the tip of you or your current partner’s lips. Here is the first rule to guide you along the path of least pain, and how to take bad news like a champ.
Just got dumped?
Rule 1: The Relationship Is Over
You tried to work it out, remember? But there’s nothing, and now they’re breaking up with you. The relationship is over. This is the reality. If they’re telling you it’s just a “break”, or “we’ll see what happens in the future”, “I still love you”… it’s still over. If they don’t want to work it out together, you’re not together.
How could you possibly respond to a breakup without making an ass of yourself? Maybe something like this:
Dick: I’m sorry, but I think we need a break.
Jane: What does that mean? You want to see other people and not work out our issues, but still be “together?”
Dick: Yes. No. I don’t know. It’s really hard...
Jane: Well either you want to work it out with me or not. Which is it?
Dick: I just think we need some time.
Jane: So then we are breaking up.
Dick: You’re trying to force this on me!
Jane: I just want to be clear what you expect.
Dick: I don’t know what I expect.
Jane: Then we should break up.
Dick: What do I care, from the hell you’ve put me through? You’ve ruined our chances of FAMILY AND FRIENDS AND LIFE AND SPOT AND OUR BLACK OPS CLAN AND ...!!!!111!11!!!
Jane: I’m...sorry?
Dick: ****YOU YOU PIECE OF **** SALLY IS SO MUCH NICER AND IS THERE FOR ME AND YOU’RE SUCH A STUPID BITCH YOU WHORE...
Jane: ...I’ll call you to arrange an exchange of our stuff.
When getting dumped, there’s not much you can do or say to stop it. If you didn’t bother to figure out the problems, maybe now is a reasonable time to be productive and ask questions. However, it gets harder and harder to not sabotage yourself (and truly listen) as things come to a close, and much less likely you can do anything to fix it. Maybe you need an hour or a week to get your head straight enough to talk. Take it, but don’t drag things out. Get a clear answer or walk, lest you live a life of constant uncertainty, disappointment, and pain as your partner has hot sex on the side with your childhood friend Sally while you wait around.
About to do some dumping?
Rule 1: The Relationship Is Over
You wouldn’t be in this phase if you bothered to work it out, right? Do you want to try other people just to see if there’s someone better, but make sure your partner is still around to fall back on? Don’t be that kind of manipulative jerk. Are you afraid you’ll be lonely without your known quantity? Too bad, you chose a breakup over fixing the relationship. Ending the relationship means ending it for good.
No one said dumping people was easy. Be empathetic and declare that the relationship as it exists now is over in no uncertain terms. Be firm, respectful, and calm. Maybe something like this:
Dick: I’m sorry, but I think we need to break up.
Jane: ****. You think? Are you sure?
Dick: Yes, I’m sure.
Jane: What about a break to see how things go?
Dick: No, we tried to work things out but I can’t keep this up.
Jane: BUT WHAT ABOUT OUR FRIENDS AND FAMILY AND LIFE AND HOUSE AND SPOT AND BLACK OPS CLAN AND...!?!?!?!?!!11!
Dick: I’m sorry.
Jane: **** YOU YOU PIECE OF **** I KNEW SALLY WAS INVOLVED SHE’S SUCH A STUPID BITCH THAT WHORE...
Dick: ...I’ll call you to arrange an exchange of our stuff.
Don’t claim things you can’t control or use words that could have lasting emotional effects on your now ex-partner. Don’t say “I’ll still love you forever,” or “We’ll stay best friends until the end of time,” or any other nonsense that does nothing but confuse your ex. Don’t offer “time apart,” a “break,” “we’ll see,” or any other middle ground. Again, if you wanted to work it out, you wouldn’t be at Rule 1. Rip off the Band-Aid.
Sub Rule 1: You Don’t Owe Your Ex Anything
If you just got dumped, they’ve given up their right to your attention, love, physical contact (and even friendship, for a time). Any attempt on their part to push their weakness or guilt in your face is manipulation. Don’t feed manipulative exes. They bite.
If you just dumped your ex respectfully, that’s the best you can do. There’s nothing else that you could possibly say or do to ease their pain. Let them move on, and control any misplaced guilt you feel from doing what was necessary to move your life forward.
The Post-Breakup Phase
It’s over and done. Rule 1. You’ve suffered some trauma going through the process of a failed relationship. What now?
Expect to go through at least some of the 5 stages of loss. You may switch back and forth, experience multiple stages at a time or one by one. These can last weeks or months. They are, in no particular order:
Denial
Bargaining
Anger
Despair
Acceptance
Denial: You’ll lie to yourself about the reality of the situation. “She still loves me, I know it,” or “there’s still a possibility even though he said there was none,” for the dumped. “He took it really well” or “She’s doing fine, we’ll be great friends in a week” for the dumper. None of these are true. This is a stupid phase and you won’t begin to feel better until you move on from here. It’s also one of the most debilitating and difficult stages to get out of, especially for the dumped that had little or no certainty in the breakup (see Eratta: Stuck in the Limbo of an Uncertain Breakup, below). You’ll repeat errors in judgment stemming from this phase over and over. Live and learn.
Bargaining: This can happen at the Premonition Phase, or after the breakup. Common are thoughts like “maybe if I show her how much she means to me with 30 rose deliveries… “ or “I could just call him 50 times and tell him how great I am for him.” If you’re still working out issues, give it a shot. If it’s over, it’s over. Don’t beg, plead, whine, or act like a child.
Anger: You were hurt or your partner did not take the breakup well. In any event, you are ****** at them or the world. You’d love to hurt them or the world emotionally or even physically in some way. Don’t do any of this. Be an adult, accept your anger and act different. Feeling angry is fine, acting angry is not (See Rule 5: Don’t Be An *******, below).
Despair: You are crushed, either because your love just left you or you feel like you destroyed someone’s life. You may tear up, cry, or crumple on the floor bawling uncontrollably. All of this is fine. You have to admit to yourself this stuff is supposed to hurt, and give yourself some time to work through it. For you macho men, better to cry in private than bury it. Despair doesn’t disappear by trying to ignore it. Don’t get stuck here, though. Follow the rules so your despair is a short, manageable stage.
Acceptance: You’ve felt like ****, but all the bad feels somehow distant, and you are confident you’ll be fine. You may not be 100%, but you can see the bright side. Maybe you shift back into another stage, and find yourself here again. Welcome to the beginnings of recovery!
Managing Your Life During the Five Stages of Loss
Here is where maybe 100% of you are right now. Getting your life together when your emotions wreak havoc on your rational side can be nightmarish. Reduce your time stuck in circular logic, cut that useless, wishful thinking and curb destructive behavior with these remaining simple rules!
Rule 2: Sever Contact With Your Ex
Before you argue, head right down to Erratta: Can I Be Friends With My Ex?, then find yourself right back here.
Think about how all of your emotional turmoil is tied up with the relationship between you and one person (and possibly their family and friends). You think staying in touch will help you get over that? No. Take a break from confronting both the source and reminders of that turmoil. Don’t call, text, email, read Facebook updates, visit, or have sex with your ex. Block their Facebook (not “hide feed,” not “unfriend”). Block their email and cell. If you live with your ex, move out. If you work with them, consider a transfer. If you share friends, spend time with other friends. Tell the people you spend time with that you want to minimize reminders, discussion, and anything else relating to your ex (unless you need to bitch. Limited venting can be cathartic if you don’t **** your friends off with too much).
Additional words of severing wisdom:
Minimaul posted:
Do yourself a favor and remove the person from your life that chose to remove you from theirs.
“Do not contact your ex” doesn't mean that YOU don't make effort to contact them but you respond when they get in touch with you. Cause, I mean, you technically didn't contact them, right? Wrong. It means NO CONTACT WITH YOUR EX...Just because you aren't contacting them that does not mean you're properly severing. It means do not even respond to them. Do not take the bait to any comments that raise your hackles, pique your interest, slander or cajole your feelings into responding...Every single contact will set you back to a point so far behind that it takes longer to catch up and move on than if you had just severed and ripped that damn band aid off.
It will be hard and sometimes they get offended. Seriously! How absurd is that? They get offended because you're severing from them when they ripped your heart of out of your ass. It seems so absurd that it's impossible, but I assure you my fellow GoonyGoons, it happens more than you think. The ex [that doesn’t bother with these rules], most often, is trying to assuage their own guilt when they remain in contact. It's entirely selfish of them. Now it's your turn to be selfish, stop talking to them and accept things and move on. Severing is acceptance and moving forward.
You can approach the sever in many responsible ways. The best is to suggest that “I am going through a lot and don’t think it’s a good idea to stay in touch for a while.” The answer to “How long?” is “When I feel ready.” When is ready? See Errata: To Date or Not to Date Immediately , below.
What do you do if, after two weeks of a perfect sever, you crash through their apartment rip-roaring drunk in a Santa hat, catch them with some other loser, scream obscenities and spit right in their face? Here’s some fine advice about relapsing:
Chocolate Milk posted:
Most people relapse at some point. The important thing to remember is that they will never respond how you want them to respond. Because what you want them to say is “I’m sorry, I love you, I’ll always love you, let’s get back together and pretend none of this ever happened”. And they’re not going to say that. And if they do, you won’t believe them, because hey: they did it once, they can do it again.
Finally, sometimes contact is inevitable. When forced into contact by accident or when you’re exchanging owned items, keep conversation cordial and short. Treat your ex like an acquaintance you don’t really want to get to know. Be nice, do your own thing.
Rule 3: Go Do Something Normal With Yourself and Friends
During the immediate post-dump, it can be a challenge to reign in those feelings. Sitting at home, sulking, stewing over the issues of the breakup, and wallowing in your despair will keep you right where you are. Find a new hobby or re-find your old ones. Go outside. Go out with friends, dance a jig, run a mile, anything. Few or no friends? Make some. Focus on short-term goals. Also, figure out the most productive time of day while you’re in this funk, and schedule your time for both good activities and letting your emotions run rampant. Sometimes you just can’t get over it, so allow yourself a little time for that.
Don't do anything rash. Don't join the army, sell all your worldly possessions, or do anything that could have lasting, regrettable effects on your life.
Rule 4: Be Healthy
Take care of your body. Eat right, exercise, and fix your sleep schedule. It is amazing how these three things affect the way you handle emotional turmoil.
Chocolate Milk posted:
The absolute best thing you can do right now is exercise. Not only is it great for your health, you will feel ******* amazing. Even if you’re not usually the sporty type, you’ll find it’s surprisingly distracting and enjoyable. And you’ll be improving yourself and your health at the same time.
Avoid mind-altering substances in excess, including alcohol. If you go drinking, ensure your ex’s number is deleted. If memorized, give your phone to your pals. Drunk texting/calling the ex is not a riot.
Take care of your mind.
nickhimself posted:
When a relationship is over the only thing you should take from it is something new you've learned about yourself.
Spend some time on self-reflection. People often say “it’s not you, it’s me,” but if you’re noticing a pattern of failed, unhealthy relationships, you might have some unresolved issues to work through. Talk with friends, family, professional counselors, psychiatrists or entertain E/N for perspective.
Rule 5: Don’t Be an *******
Life sucks and there’s nothing you can do about it. When life sucks, it’s easy to be an *******. Life sucks even more when ******** assert their assholery and ruin everyone else’s lives and their own. Don’t be that *******. Don’t harass, threaten, repeatedly whine and cry, or stalk your ex through any medium of communication. This includes through their friends and/or family. You can feel like ****, but put your game face on in public. Bitch to your close friends, take boxing lessons, or write in a private journal. Hopefully if you stick to Rule 2, you won’t have to worry about any of this.
A Really Serious Note: In most US States, harassment is a very nebulous yet real criminal charge, at minimum a misdemeanor (which can include jail time). It can be defined as physical threats to property, threats to the filing individual, and threats to the friends and family of the filing individual. Essentially, if you even insinuate physical harm to people or things, that’s enough. No-contact orders can be granted on little more than this simple harassment. Cell phone texts, Facebook posts and emails are frequent sources of evidence for this (I know this for a fact; I watch Bones). Violation of these orders is a serious criminal offense and will **** up your life. And this is just verbal harassment. Don’t be that guy or girl.
Erratta
Here are some other useful things to think about that relate to the basic rules above. Consider them carefully.
To Date or Not to Date Immediately?
This issue is hotly debated. Is it best to jump right into a rebound to help you forget your ex? I’ll admit it has helped me before. Sometimes casual relationships can wean you off of that desire for intimate contact with your ex while you work through your emotional challenges. However, you must be upfront with the people you date. Still, even if you slap them across the face with it, people fantasize, “listen to their heart,” and generally put themselves in precarious situations for love. In these common cases, it’s rare someone doesn’t get hurt. I’ve seen both sides, and it’s a dangerous game to play. Be careful.
When is the right time to consider a new relationship? How do you know when you’re ready?
One good rule of thumb is that you’re not really over a relationship until you’re no longer interested in dating that person again. If they came up to you and said, “let’s get back together”, and your answer’s anything other than “hell no”, you’re probably not ready to date again.
The king of love, Phil Collins, suggests that you never really “get completely over” having your heart broken. Still, people move on to happy, constructive relationships after serious heart-crushing. It’s not about erasing all the feelings you had for someone; it’s about living with them and being able to make room for others.
Stuck in the Limbo of an Uncertain Breakup
Did your ex leave you hanging with a “we’ll see” in response to asking if there was future possibilities? Couldn’t draw anything concrete out of them? You may be stuck bargaining with yourself in Despair Stage limbo, and find yourself unable to move on until you come to terms with Rule 1.
How do you break yourself out of this cycle of telling yourself “maybe” when you know it’s wishful thinking? You’re living Rule 1-5, and your life is still miserable. Adhere even stronger to the rules, force yourself out of spinning your wheels, and maybe get thee to a counselor for some CBT. In other words, this is the most challenging type of despair to get out of, and you need to work hard to get yourself on track.
Closure
This is probably the biggest reason people completely fail on Rule 2 and suffer.
Closure could mean one final “**** you,” a last hurrah in the sack, that satisfying answer to why everything fell apart and anything in between. Sadly, if you weasel anything out of your ex, you probably didn’t want to hear it in the first place.
Most often, there is no such thing as closure and nothing your ex could say would make you feel better. This is also nearly always has the same result: it never matters what they say, and now you feel even worse. Moral? Don’t bother looking for closure. Create your own and move on.
Can I Be Friends With My Ex?
Chocolate Milk posted:
Sure. You can be friends with your ex. But not now.
Most people don’t end up being friends with their ex, and it’s not because they stop talking to them. It’s because they don’t stop talking to them. You can’t be friends with someone you used to love unless all those feelings are gone. You need to take the time to be apart and to get some space. Otherwise you’ll never get over them; you’ll see them with new people and it’ll kill you inside. What kind of a friendship is that?
If you’re the dumper, it’s going to be harder for you, because you won’t really know for sure if they’re over you. Dating other people doesn’t guarantee anything. The important thing is to give them space (even if they don’t want space, even if they want to keep talking to you) and maybe try at being friends after a few months.
Well, there you have it. Get right to breaking every one of these and teach everyone your hard-learned lessons, or share your success and be a model for all.
Much thanks to all of the contributors to this and the last thread. You know who you are!
Many people have been where you are, and you can probably find your answer in history. READ the original thread
"To the dumped and dumpers alike, welcome to the Breakup Megathread. If you’re starting to suspect an end to your romantic world as you know it, it just ended, or you’re five months down the road and it’s all coming back to haunt you, hopefully this thread and the people in it can give you some useful advice to avoid those pesky restraining orders. But before we get too far along:
Lushka16’s Breakup Megathread Theorem: Every one of you will invariably cherry-pick, feel a compulsion to ignore or otherwise neglect most or all of the fantastic advice detailed below, assuming it doesn’t apply to you.
Minimaul’s Megathread Corollary: You are not a special *********. You are not the exception to the rule. You are not the anecdote that proves the rule wrong. You are not in a Jennifer Aniston movie. You are not a movie with an acceptable ending for the whole audience. This is life.
All right. What's next? Everyone loves phases. For any breakup, there are three main phases: Premonition, Breakup, and Post Breakup. This guide holds your hand through each phase and provides a plethora of prescriptions to help you past the Post Breakup phase and beyond.
The Premonition Phase
Ever felt like your boyfriend or girlfriend is acting distant or uninterested in a way that’s getting under your skin? Do they seem to pick at everything you do, spend much of their energy finding ways to be away from you, or are no longer interested in sex or physical intimacy? You are probably in the premonition phase as they (or you) consider the reasonableness of breaking up. During this time you may feel a lack of communication and uncertainty—basically hell—in the relationship.
But wait! Nothing is inevitable. Couples have problems, and many can be worked out with a little effort as long as you don’t sabotage yourself. How to avoid that, you ask? I’m glad you asked!
How to Not Sabotage Yourself:
- Don’t do something that you don’t normally do or say something that isn’t true. Don’t drop “I love you” or propose marriage in an attempt to save the relationship, or suggest you might be pregnant if you’re not. Don’t threaten your partner. Every one of these actions will likely fail, and even if they do stave off the breakup in the short term, they could create any number of terrible feelings (or land you in jail if you’re really stupid).
- Don’t start cheating. Don’t continue cheating. The relationship isn’t over yet. Remember?
- Don’t flip out. If the relationship is already on edge, angry or defensive outbursts, temper tantrums, or even an accusatory or derisive tone of voice will make already tenuous matters much, much worse.
- Don’t try to break up with them first unless you were already planning on doing this. This is petty and obviously has no chance of saving anything. Skip ahead to the Breakup Phase if that’s your bent.
- Know what you expect from your partner and for yourself, and determine this before you go into any discussion. Be prepared to stand by important principles and needs, yet be flexible where reasonable. Discuss your expectations with family, friends or brilliant folks in E/N to help get some well-deserved perspective.
- Talk to your partner. Ask questions. Do your best to understand what is going wrong and ask for ways that you can help to improve the situation. Explain your expectations. Be open, honest, and respectful. Trust your partner and listen.
- Be ready to accept their answers gracefully, and realize there may be nothing you can do to stop the breakup. This may lead you right to the Breakup Phase. Great. No reason to drag out a failing, unhappy relationship.
The Breakup Phase
So you’ve found yourself in an irreconcilable romantic affair and those fateful words are on the tip of you or your current partner’s lips. Here is the first rule to guide you along the path of least pain, and how to take bad news like a champ.
Just got dumped?
Rule 1: The Relationship Is Over
You tried to work it out, remember? But there’s nothing, and now they’re breaking up with you. The relationship is over. This is the reality. If they’re telling you it’s just a “break”, or “we’ll see what happens in the future”, “I still love you”… it’s still over. If they don’t want to work it out together, you’re not together.
How could you possibly respond to a breakup without making an ass of yourself? Maybe something like this:
Dick: I’m sorry, but I think we need a break.
Jane: What does that mean? You want to see other people and not work out our issues, but still be “together?”
Dick: Yes. No. I don’t know. It’s really hard...
Jane: Well either you want to work it out with me or not. Which is it?
Dick: I just think we need some time.
Jane: So then we are breaking up.
Dick: You’re trying to force this on me!
Jane: I just want to be clear what you expect.
Dick: I don’t know what I expect.
Jane: Then we should break up.
Dick: What do I care, from the hell you’ve put me through? You’ve ruined our chances of FAMILY AND FRIENDS AND LIFE AND SPOT AND OUR BLACK OPS CLAN AND ...!!!!111!11!!!
Jane: I’m...sorry?
Dick: ****YOU YOU PIECE OF **** SALLY IS SO MUCH NICER AND IS THERE FOR ME AND YOU’RE SUCH A STUPID BITCH YOU WHORE...
Jane: ...I’ll call you to arrange an exchange of our stuff.
When getting dumped, there’s not much you can do or say to stop it. If you didn’t bother to figure out the problems, maybe now is a reasonable time to be productive and ask questions. However, it gets harder and harder to not sabotage yourself (and truly listen) as things come to a close, and much less likely you can do anything to fix it. Maybe you need an hour or a week to get your head straight enough to talk. Take it, but don’t drag things out. Get a clear answer or walk, lest you live a life of constant uncertainty, disappointment, and pain as your partner has hot sex on the side with your childhood friend Sally while you wait around.
About to do some dumping?
Rule 1: The Relationship Is Over
You wouldn’t be in this phase if you bothered to work it out, right? Do you want to try other people just to see if there’s someone better, but make sure your partner is still around to fall back on? Don’t be that kind of manipulative jerk. Are you afraid you’ll be lonely without your known quantity? Too bad, you chose a breakup over fixing the relationship. Ending the relationship means ending it for good.
No one said dumping people was easy. Be empathetic and declare that the relationship as it exists now is over in no uncertain terms. Be firm, respectful, and calm. Maybe something like this:
Dick: I’m sorry, but I think we need to break up.
Jane: ****. You think? Are you sure?
Dick: Yes, I’m sure.
Jane: What about a break to see how things go?
Dick: No, we tried to work things out but I can’t keep this up.
Jane: BUT WHAT ABOUT OUR FRIENDS AND FAMILY AND LIFE AND HOUSE AND SPOT AND BLACK OPS CLAN AND...!?!?!?!?!!11!
Dick: I’m sorry.
Jane: **** YOU YOU PIECE OF **** I KNEW SALLY WAS INVOLVED SHE’S SUCH A STUPID BITCH THAT WHORE...
Dick: ...I’ll call you to arrange an exchange of our stuff.
Don’t claim things you can’t control or use words that could have lasting emotional effects on your now ex-partner. Don’t say “I’ll still love you forever,” or “We’ll stay best friends until the end of time,” or any other nonsense that does nothing but confuse your ex. Don’t offer “time apart,” a “break,” “we’ll see,” or any other middle ground. Again, if you wanted to work it out, you wouldn’t be at Rule 1. Rip off the Band-Aid.
Sub Rule 1: You Don’t Owe Your Ex Anything
If you just got dumped, they’ve given up their right to your attention, love, physical contact (and even friendship, for a time). Any attempt on their part to push their weakness or guilt in your face is manipulation. Don’t feed manipulative exes. They bite.
If you just dumped your ex respectfully, that’s the best you can do. There’s nothing else that you could possibly say or do to ease their pain. Let them move on, and control any misplaced guilt you feel from doing what was necessary to move your life forward.
The Post-Breakup Phase
It’s over and done. Rule 1. You’ve suffered some trauma going through the process of a failed relationship. What now?
Expect to go through at least some of the 5 stages of loss. You may switch back and forth, experience multiple stages at a time or one by one. These can last weeks or months. They are, in no particular order:
Denial
Bargaining
Anger
Despair
Acceptance
Denial: You’ll lie to yourself about the reality of the situation. “She still loves me, I know it,” or “there’s still a possibility even though he said there was none,” for the dumped. “He took it really well” or “She’s doing fine, we’ll be great friends in a week” for the dumper. None of these are true. This is a stupid phase and you won’t begin to feel better until you move on from here. It’s also one of the most debilitating and difficult stages to get out of, especially for the dumped that had little or no certainty in the breakup (see Eratta: Stuck in the Limbo of an Uncertain Breakup, below). You’ll repeat errors in judgment stemming from this phase over and over. Live and learn.
Bargaining: This can happen at the Premonition Phase, or after the breakup. Common are thoughts like “maybe if I show her how much she means to me with 30 rose deliveries… “ or “I could just call him 50 times and tell him how great I am for him.” If you’re still working out issues, give it a shot. If it’s over, it’s over. Don’t beg, plead, whine, or act like a child.
Anger: You were hurt or your partner did not take the breakup well. In any event, you are ****** at them or the world. You’d love to hurt them or the world emotionally or even physically in some way. Don’t do any of this. Be an adult, accept your anger and act different. Feeling angry is fine, acting angry is not (See Rule 5: Don’t Be An *******, below).
Despair: You are crushed, either because your love just left you or you feel like you destroyed someone’s life. You may tear up, cry, or crumple on the floor bawling uncontrollably. All of this is fine. You have to admit to yourself this stuff is supposed to hurt, and give yourself some time to work through it. For you macho men, better to cry in private than bury it. Despair doesn’t disappear by trying to ignore it. Don’t get stuck here, though. Follow the rules so your despair is a short, manageable stage.
Acceptance: You’ve felt like ****, but all the bad feels somehow distant, and you are confident you’ll be fine. You may not be 100%, but you can see the bright side. Maybe you shift back into another stage, and find yourself here again. Welcome to the beginnings of recovery!
Managing Your Life During the Five Stages of Loss
Here is where maybe 100% of you are right now. Getting your life together when your emotions wreak havoc on your rational side can be nightmarish. Reduce your time stuck in circular logic, cut that useless, wishful thinking and curb destructive behavior with these remaining simple rules!
Rule 2: Sever Contact With Your Ex
Before you argue, head right down to Erratta: Can I Be Friends With My Ex?, then find yourself right back here.
Think about how all of your emotional turmoil is tied up with the relationship between you and one person (and possibly their family and friends). You think staying in touch will help you get over that? No. Take a break from confronting both the source and reminders of that turmoil. Don’t call, text, email, read Facebook updates, visit, or have sex with your ex. Block their Facebook (not “hide feed,” not “unfriend”). Block their email and cell. If you live with your ex, move out. If you work with them, consider a transfer. If you share friends, spend time with other friends. Tell the people you spend time with that you want to minimize reminders, discussion, and anything else relating to your ex (unless you need to bitch. Limited venting can be cathartic if you don’t **** your friends off with too much).
Additional words of severing wisdom:
Minimaul posted:
Do yourself a favor and remove the person from your life that chose to remove you from theirs.
“Do not contact your ex” doesn't mean that YOU don't make effort to contact them but you respond when they get in touch with you. Cause, I mean, you technically didn't contact them, right? Wrong. It means NO CONTACT WITH YOUR EX...Just because you aren't contacting them that does not mean you're properly severing. It means do not even respond to them. Do not take the bait to any comments that raise your hackles, pique your interest, slander or cajole your feelings into responding...Every single contact will set you back to a point so far behind that it takes longer to catch up and move on than if you had just severed and ripped that damn band aid off.
It will be hard and sometimes they get offended. Seriously! How absurd is that? They get offended because you're severing from them when they ripped your heart of out of your ass. It seems so absurd that it's impossible, but I assure you my fellow GoonyGoons, it happens more than you think. The ex [that doesn’t bother with these rules], most often, is trying to assuage their own guilt when they remain in contact. It's entirely selfish of them. Now it's your turn to be selfish, stop talking to them and accept things and move on. Severing is acceptance and moving forward.
You can approach the sever in many responsible ways. The best is to suggest that “I am going through a lot and don’t think it’s a good idea to stay in touch for a while.” The answer to “How long?” is “When I feel ready.” When is ready? See Errata: To Date or Not to Date Immediately , below.
What do you do if, after two weeks of a perfect sever, you crash through their apartment rip-roaring drunk in a Santa hat, catch them with some other loser, scream obscenities and spit right in their face? Here’s some fine advice about relapsing:
Chocolate Milk posted:
Most people relapse at some point. The important thing to remember is that they will never respond how you want them to respond. Because what you want them to say is “I’m sorry, I love you, I’ll always love you, let’s get back together and pretend none of this ever happened”. And they’re not going to say that. And if they do, you won’t believe them, because hey: they did it once, they can do it again.
Finally, sometimes contact is inevitable. When forced into contact by accident or when you’re exchanging owned items, keep conversation cordial and short. Treat your ex like an acquaintance you don’t really want to get to know. Be nice, do your own thing.
Rule 3: Go Do Something Normal With Yourself and Friends
During the immediate post-dump, it can be a challenge to reign in those feelings. Sitting at home, sulking, stewing over the issues of the breakup, and wallowing in your despair will keep you right where you are. Find a new hobby or re-find your old ones. Go outside. Go out with friends, dance a jig, run a mile, anything. Few or no friends? Make some. Focus on short-term goals. Also, figure out the most productive time of day while you’re in this funk, and schedule your time for both good activities and letting your emotions run rampant. Sometimes you just can’t get over it, so allow yourself a little time for that.
Don't do anything rash. Don't join the army, sell all your worldly possessions, or do anything that could have lasting, regrettable effects on your life.
Rule 4: Be Healthy
Take care of your body. Eat right, exercise, and fix your sleep schedule. It is amazing how these three things affect the way you handle emotional turmoil.
Chocolate Milk posted:
The absolute best thing you can do right now is exercise. Not only is it great for your health, you will feel ******* amazing. Even if you’re not usually the sporty type, you’ll find it’s surprisingly distracting and enjoyable. And you’ll be improving yourself and your health at the same time.
Avoid mind-altering substances in excess, including alcohol. If you go drinking, ensure your ex’s number is deleted. If memorized, give your phone to your pals. Drunk texting/calling the ex is not a riot.
Take care of your mind.
nickhimself posted:
When a relationship is over the only thing you should take from it is something new you've learned about yourself.
Spend some time on self-reflection. People often say “it’s not you, it’s me,” but if you’re noticing a pattern of failed, unhealthy relationships, you might have some unresolved issues to work through. Talk with friends, family, professional counselors, psychiatrists or entertain E/N for perspective.
Rule 5: Don’t Be an *******
Life sucks and there’s nothing you can do about it. When life sucks, it’s easy to be an *******. Life sucks even more when ******** assert their assholery and ruin everyone else’s lives and their own. Don’t be that *******. Don’t harass, threaten, repeatedly whine and cry, or stalk your ex through any medium of communication. This includes through their friends and/or family. You can feel like ****, but put your game face on in public. Bitch to your close friends, take boxing lessons, or write in a private journal. Hopefully if you stick to Rule 2, you won’t have to worry about any of this.
A Really Serious Note: In most US States, harassment is a very nebulous yet real criminal charge, at minimum a misdemeanor (which can include jail time). It can be defined as physical threats to property, threats to the filing individual, and threats to the friends and family of the filing individual. Essentially, if you even insinuate physical harm to people or things, that’s enough. No-contact orders can be granted on little more than this simple harassment. Cell phone texts, Facebook posts and emails are frequent sources of evidence for this (I know this for a fact; I watch Bones). Violation of these orders is a serious criminal offense and will **** up your life. And this is just verbal harassment. Don’t be that guy or girl.
Erratta
Here are some other useful things to think about that relate to the basic rules above. Consider them carefully.
To Date or Not to Date Immediately?
This issue is hotly debated. Is it best to jump right into a rebound to help you forget your ex? I’ll admit it has helped me before. Sometimes casual relationships can wean you off of that desire for intimate contact with your ex while you work through your emotional challenges. However, you must be upfront with the people you date. Still, even if you slap them across the face with it, people fantasize, “listen to their heart,” and generally put themselves in precarious situations for love. In these common cases, it’s rare someone doesn’t get hurt. I’ve seen both sides, and it’s a dangerous game to play. Be careful.
When is the right time to consider a new relationship? How do you know when you’re ready?
One good rule of thumb is that you’re not really over a relationship until you’re no longer interested in dating that person again. If they came up to you and said, “let’s get back together”, and your answer’s anything other than “hell no”, you’re probably not ready to date again.
The king of love, Phil Collins, suggests that you never really “get completely over” having your heart broken. Still, people move on to happy, constructive relationships after serious heart-crushing. It’s not about erasing all the feelings you had for someone; it’s about living with them and being able to make room for others.
Stuck in the Limbo of an Uncertain Breakup
Did your ex leave you hanging with a “we’ll see” in response to asking if there was future possibilities? Couldn’t draw anything concrete out of them? You may be stuck bargaining with yourself in Despair Stage limbo, and find yourself unable to move on until you come to terms with Rule 1.
How do you break yourself out of this cycle of telling yourself “maybe” when you know it’s wishful thinking? You’re living Rule 1-5, and your life is still miserable. Adhere even stronger to the rules, force yourself out of spinning your wheels, and maybe get thee to a counselor for some CBT. In other words, this is the most challenging type of despair to get out of, and you need to work hard to get yourself on track.
Closure
This is probably the biggest reason people completely fail on Rule 2 and suffer.
Closure could mean one final “**** you,” a last hurrah in the sack, that satisfying answer to why everything fell apart and anything in between. Sadly, if you weasel anything out of your ex, you probably didn’t want to hear it in the first place.
Most often, there is no such thing as closure and nothing your ex could say would make you feel better. This is also nearly always has the same result: it never matters what they say, and now you feel even worse. Moral? Don’t bother looking for closure. Create your own and move on.
Can I Be Friends With My Ex?
Chocolate Milk posted:
Sure. You can be friends with your ex. But not now.
Most people don’t end up being friends with their ex, and it’s not because they stop talking to them. It’s because they don’t stop talking to them. You can’t be friends with someone you used to love unless all those feelings are gone. You need to take the time to be apart and to get some space. Otherwise you’ll never get over them; you’ll see them with new people and it’ll kill you inside. What kind of a friendship is that?
If you’re the dumper, it’s going to be harder for you, because you won’t really know for sure if they’re over you. Dating other people doesn’t guarantee anything. The important thing is to give them space (even if they don’t want space, even if they want to keep talking to you) and maybe try at being friends after a few months.
Well, there you have it. Get right to breaking every one of these and teach everyone your hard-learned lessons, or share your success and be a model for all.
Much thanks to all of the contributors to this and the last thread. You know who you are!
Many people have been where you are, and you can probably find your answer in history. READ the original thread
Same amount of time you could have put your foot through the door and purchased a new lock from Wilko's (RIP) or Amazon
Less than £150.All of us do but we prioritise logic first before emotion. Women, its usually emotions first then logic after.
Same amount of time you could have put your foot through the door and purchased a new lock from Wilko's (RIP) or Amazon
All of us do but we prioritise logic first before emotion. Women, its usually emotions first then logic after.
Unfortunately pal I'm disabled